Peak Testosterone Forum

General Category => Testosterone, Hormones and General Men's Health => Topic started by: bkb333 on January 10, 2019, 08:52:01 am

Title: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: bkb333 on January 10, 2019, 08:52:01 am
Hi gang,

My cream is set to arrive tomorrow, thereby commencing my TRT protocol (I have not used T up to this point). My prescription is 1-2 clicks per day (.25 per click), and I will apply it to the scrotal region.

Have you applied cream to your scrotal area before? Anything I should know ahead of time about dispensing/applying the medication? Though there are (understandably) a lot of "how to inject yourself" videos out there, I haven't found many resources pertinent to scrotal cream application. Any advice would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance!
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: Cataceous on January 10, 2019, 09:42:19 am
I have done it, though can't think of much to say about the application except to let it dry a little before allowing clothing contact. Some guys use the applicator directly, others use fingers. I don't think it matters much. Hopefully you will have better luck with transdermal testosterone than I did.
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: bkb333 on January 10, 2019, 09:48:05 am
I have done it, though can't think of much to say about the application except to let it dry a little before allowing clothing contact. Some guys use the applicator directly, others use fingers. I don't think it matters much. Hopefully you will have better luck with transdermal testosterone than I did.

Thanks! I am encouraged by some of the stories/research I've seen lately. Also, if I am applying multiple clicks (ex: 2 per day), does it matter if both are applied at the same time, or should they be spaced out (ex: 1 in morning, 1 at night)?
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: Cataceous on January 10, 2019, 09:52:40 am
.... Also, if I am applying multiple clicks (ex: 2 per day), does it matter if both are applied at the same time, or should they be spaced out (ex: 1 in morning, 1 at night)?

I'd start with the easier approach of all at once, early morning. Ideally this somewhat mimics a normal diurnal rhythm. But if you're not getting good results then you can try spacing them out.
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: Flyingfool on January 10, 2019, 09:58:21 am
Ignorance here. But I will ask it anyway.

Does shaving help or aid absorption? 

I realize that absorption rates are significantly higher on scrotum versus other topical areas on compared to say shoulders. I have read anywhere between 5 and 10 times more absorption. So maybe shaving scrotum is insignificant gain compared to shaving othwr applocation sites a guy could use.
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: Cataceous on January 10, 2019, 10:26:43 am
..
Does shaving help or aid absorption? 
...

It could help, reducing waste. But it'd only be worthwhile if the "hairy boys" were really hairy. I did get good initial absorption of Androgel with shaved underarms. But within a couple days my usual absorption and conversion problems returned.
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: ghce on January 10, 2019, 01:02:30 pm
Shaving is a really good idea as it makes application easy, quick and less messy.
Its very easy to overdo the amount of resultant T and DHT that you get from Scrotal application, you probably need more regular blood tests to see whats going on.
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: bkb333 on January 10, 2019, 01:42:36 pm
Thanks, guys, for the input! I'll be doing some shaving.

Another question: is there a difference in dosing between injectables/creams? For example, I have 200mg T-cyp. My prescription is 1-2 clicks per day, or .25-.50 per day, working up to 4 clicks per day. How does this dosage compare to a normal injectable T dosage?
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: HRD LVN on January 10, 2019, 03:48:56 pm
Thanks, guys, for the input! I'll be doing some shaving.

Another question: is there a difference in dosing between injectables/creams? For example, I have 200mg T-cyp. My prescription is 1-2 clicks per day, or .25-.50 per day, working up to 4 clicks per day. How does this dosage compare to a normal injectable T dosage?
No one knows what your adsorbtion rate is. You will need to do lots of mini blood tests to get the cream dialed in. Nice thing about creams is you don't have to wait 40 days to do bloods.
I got to ask are you prone to acne?

I was a cream guy for over 6 months. I naired my balls shaving scared the hell out of me. My wife liked it so much I still nair even on T shots for 3 years.
If you are good with the nair you can even get your cock ring area oh hell your 27 you don't need a cockring.
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: bkb333 on January 10, 2019, 04:41:41 pm
No one knows what your adsorbtion rate is. You will need to do lots of mini blood tests to get the cream dialed in. Nice thing about creams is you don't have to wait 40 days to do bloods.
I got to ask are you prone to acne?

I was a cream guy for over 6 months. I naired my balls shaving scared the hell out of me. My wife liked it so much I still nair even on T shots for 3 years.
If you are good with the nair you can even get your cock ring area oh hell your 27 you don't need a cockring.

Fortunately, I'm not prone to acne -- had a little bit in high school, but totally clear since. Did you use the cream on your balls? Why did you decide to switch to shots?
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: Cataceous on January 10, 2019, 06:25:20 pm
... I naired my balls shaving scared the hell out of me. My wife liked it so much I still nair even on T shots for 3 years.
If you are good with the nair you can even get your cock ring area ...

Interesting. Any irritation? The manufacturer advises (http://www.naircare.com/en/Men/FAQ) against this...

Quote
Why can’t I use this on my head, face, nose, ears, nipples, perianal area or genital areas?

Depilatories are strongly alkaline and can be erosive in areas of mucous membranes and other sensitive parts of the body. Use of any depilatories in these sensitive areas, especially if left in contact for any length of time, can cause irritation.
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: HRD LVN on January 10, 2019, 06:54:00 pm
... I naired my balls shaving scared the hell out of me. My wife liked it so much I still nair even on T shots for 3 years.
If you are good with the nair you can even get your cock ring area ...

Interesting. Any irritation? The manufacturer advises (http://www.naircare.com/en/Men/FAQ) against this...

Quote
Why can’t I use this on my head, face, nose, ears, nipples, perianal area or genital areas?

Depilatories are strongly alkaline and can be erosive in areas of mucous membranes and other sensitive parts of the body. Use of any depilatories in these sensitive areas, especially if left in contact for any length of time, can cause irritation.
You will only take the hair off your nipples once with nair. ((( Ouch!))) I have no issues with my nutsack. Just keep it off the head of your penis that probably would not be good either, don't know for sure.

With practice you can get really good. Setting on the toilet is best so you boys are swinging. I like to keep the hair on my inner legs to prevent chaffing. I will treat 1/2-3/4" at the base of my penis for a cockring. Removal is now painless.  Found 6 minutes works the best on my hair you will have to experiment thick coarse hair takes more time.

Then jump right in the shower and use your normal body wash soap.  If you trim the hair on you inner thigh and your pubs just a little and sport the bald balls its a pretty nice look. Well at least my wife says so and the first time she popped one of my non hairy balls in her mouth I was sold.  Gaud, I'm glad my wife does not read this forum. haha
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: ghce on January 10, 2019, 08:23:15 pm
... I naired my balls shaving scared the hell out of me. My wife liked it so much I still nair even on T shots for 3 years.
If you are good with the nair you can even get your cock ring area ...

Interesting. Any irritation? The manufacturer advises (http://www.naircare.com/en/Men/FAQ) against this...

Quote
Why can’t I use this on my head, face, nose, ears, nipples, perianal area or genital areas?

Depilatories are strongly alkaline and can be erosive in areas of mucous membranes and other sensitive parts of the body. Use of any depilatories in these sensitive areas, especially if left in contact for any length of time, can cause irritation.
You will only take the hair off your nipples once with nair. ((( Ouch!))) I have no issues with my nutsack. Just keep it off the head of your penis that probably would not be good either, don't know for sure.

With practice you can get really good. Setting on the toilet is best so you boys are swinging. I like to keep the hair on my inner legs to prevent chaffing. I will treat 1/2-3/4" at the base of my penis for a cockring. Removal is now painless.  Found 6 minutes works the best on my hair you will have to experiment thick coarse hair takes more time.

Then jump right in the shower and use your normal body wash soap.  If you trim the hair on you inner thigh and your pubs just a little and sport the bald balls its a pretty nice look. Well at least my wife says so and the first time she popped one of my non hairy balls in her mouth I was sold.  Gaud, I'm glad my wife does not read this forum. haha

I just used a Gillette standard 3 blade safety Razor, no problems at all. DONT use a foil or rotary Razor, that way leads to pain and blood loss :( dont ask how I know lol, same goes for a trimmer, even more blood loss, even the nasal or eyebrow trimming types will leave you scared.
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: bkb333 on January 13, 2019, 05:23:29 pm
Thanks, guys, for the input! I'll be doing some shaving.

Another question: is there a difference in dosing between injectables/creams? For example, I have 200mg T-cyp. My prescription is 1-2 clicks per day, or .25-.50 per day, working up to 4 clicks per day. How does this dosage compare to a normal injectable T dosage?

Hi all, just wanted to revive this question to see if anyone can help. For example, if I were prescribed .15 of 200 mg/mil via injections, how many clicks would this translate to? Thank you!
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: Cataceous on January 13, 2019, 07:20:38 pm
...
Hi all, just wanted to revive this question to see if anyone can help. For example, if I were prescribed .15 of 200 mg/mil via injections, how many clicks would this translate to? Thank you!

"HRD LVN" did answer above, noting that the absorption rate varies. It varies not just from person to person, but can change without warning for anyone. If you want a very rough idea: through normal skin the estimate is 10% absorption. Absorption through scrotal skin is considerably higher, possibly up to around 60%. In contrast, injections give you 100% of the testosterone that's attached to the ester.

In your example, 30 mg of T cypionate means that 21 mg of testosterone is injected (T cyp is 70% T). To get the same dose via topical testosterone at 60% absorption efficiency would mean that 35 mg of T  (21 / 0.6) must be applied to the skin. This would be spread out over the same number of days as were between the injections. If your cream is 200 mg/mL then it's about three quarters of a click.

If absorption efficiency is only 10% then 210 mg T must be applied, spread out over the number of inter-injection days. This is a little over four clicks at 50 mg/click.
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: bkb333 on January 13, 2019, 08:05:05 pm
"HRD LVN" did answer above, noting that the absorption rate varies. It varies not just from person to person, but can change without warning for anyone. If you want a very rough idea: through normal skin the estimate is 10% absorption. Absorption through scrotal skin is considerably higher, possibly up to around 60%. In contrast, injections give you 100% of the testosterone that's attached to the ester.

In your example, 30 mg of T cypionate means that 21 mg of testosterone is injected (T cyp is 70% T). To get the same dose via topical testosterone at 60% absorption efficiency would mean that 35 mg of T  (21 / 0.6) must be applied to the skin. This would be spread out over the same number of days as were between the injections. If your cream is 200 mg/mL then it's about three quarters of a click.

If absorption efficiency is only 10% then 210 mg T must be applied, spread out over the number of inter-injection days. This is a little over four clicks at 50 mg/click.

Thank you for the very thoughtful, thorough answer! You're the man.
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: bkb333 on January 14, 2019, 04:23:59 am
Now that I understand the dosages (thank you for your help!), I'll bounce this question off of you. As I mentioned, my prescription is 1-2 clicks per day, but I was instructed to work up to 4 clicks per day if I do not see symptom resolution. How long would you give it at the current dosage before reevaluating? I've read men typically start seeing the effects of exogenous T at 3-6 weeks.
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: Cataceous on January 14, 2019, 06:24:19 am
There are two related issues here. The first is insuring that you have restored serum testosterone to normal levels. This can be verified by blood tests. Typically the test is done at the assumed peak, two hours post-application. But it may also be useful to know the pre-application trough value. You can attempt to use subjective results rather than lab tests, but this is difficult given the long and variable periods over which low-T symptoms may resolve. On this issue I refer you to a useful article: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3188848/

Quote
Effects on sexual interest appear after 3 weeks plateauing at 6 weeks, with no further increments expected beyond. Changes in erections/ejaculations may require up to 6 months. Effects on quality of life manifest within 3–4 weeks, but maximum benefits take longer. Effects on depressive mood become detectable after 3–6 weeks with a maximum after 18–30 weeks. Effects on erythropoiesis are evident at 3 months, peaking at 9–12 months. Prostate-specific antigen and volume rise, marginally, plateauing at 12 months; further increase should be related to aging rather than therapy. Effects on lipids appear after 4 weeks, maximal after 6–12 months. Insulin sensitivity may improve within few days, but effects on glycemic control become evident only after 3–12 months. Changes in fat mass, lean body mass, and muscle strength occur within 12–16 weeks, stabilize at 6–12 months, but can marginally continue over years. Effects on inflammation occur within 3–12 weeks. Effects on bone are detectable already after 6 months while continuing at least for 3 years.
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: bkb333 on January 14, 2019, 07:14:15 am
There are two related issues here. The first is insuring that you have restored serum testosterone to normal levels. This can be verified by blood tests. Typically the test is done at the assumed peak, two hours post-application. But it may also be useful to know the pre-application trough value. You can attempt to use subjective results rather than lab tests, but this is difficult given the long and variable period over which low-T symptoms may resolve. On this issue I refer you to a useful article on the subject: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3188848/

Quote
Effects on sexual interest appear after 3 weeks plateauing at 6 weeks, with no further increments expected beyond. Changes in erections/ejaculations may require up to 6 months. Effects on quality of life manifest within 3–4 weeks, but maximum benefits take longer. Effects on depressive mood become detectable after 3–6 weeks with a maximum after 18–30 weeks. Effects on erythropoiesis are evident at 3 months, peaking at 9–12 months. Prostate-specific antigen and volume rise, marginally, plateauing at 12 months; further increase should be related to aging rather than therapy. Effects on lipids appear after 4 weeks, maximal after 6–12 months. Insulin sensitivity may improve within few days, but effects on glycemic control become evident only after 3–12 months. Changes in fat mass, lean body mass, and muscle strength occur within 12–16 weeks, stabilize at 6–12 months, but can marginally continue over years. Effects on inflammation occur within 3–12 weeks. Effects on bone are detectable already after 6 months while continuing at least for 3 years.

Awesome. Thank you again for all the help!

Another question for anyone with experience with scrotal application of cream: how do you avoid it rubbing off (ex: onto underwear)? Do you wait in the bathroom for a while for it to dry, or do you go about your day and assume much won't rub off?
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: ghce on January 14, 2019, 12:51:16 pm
There are two related issues here. The first is insuring that you have restored serum testosterone to normal levels. This can be verified by blood tests. Typically the test is done at the assumed peak, two hours post-application. But it may also be useful to know the pre-application trough value. You can attempt to use subjective results rather than lab tests, but this is difficult given the long and variable period over which low-T symptoms may resolve. On this issue I refer you to a useful article on the subject: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3188848/

Quote
Effects on sexual interest appear after 3 weeks plateauing at 6 weeks, with no further increments expected beyond. Changes in erections/ejaculations may require up to 6 months. Effects on quality of life manifest within 3–4 weeks, but maximum benefits take longer. Effects on depressive mood become detectable after 3–6 weeks with a maximum after 18–30 weeks. Effects on erythropoiesis are evident at 3 months, peaking at 9–12 months. Prostate-specific antigen and volume rise, marginally, plateauing at 12 months; further increase should be related to aging rather than therapy. Effects on lipids appear after 4 weeks, maximal after 6–12 months. Insulin sensitivity may improve within few days, but effects on glycemic control become evident only after 3–12 months. Changes in fat mass, lean body mass, and muscle strength occur within 12–16 weeks, stabilize at 6–12 months, but can marginally continue over years. Effects on inflammation occur within 3–12 weeks. Effects on bone are detectable already after 6 months while continuing at least for 3 years.

Awesome. Thank you again for all the help!

Another question for anyone with experience with scrotal application of cream: how do you avoid it rubbing off (ex: onto underwear)? Do you wait in the bathroom for a while for it to dry, or do you go about your day and assume much won't rub off?

Cream absorbs very quickly depending on its formulation. I found the waiting period before dressing was about 5 minutes  but can depend on how hot you are as well. Typically I was applying cream after showering in the morning and if it was a hot day or I was sweating the cream took longer to dry.
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: bkb333 on February 06, 2019, 10:20:22 am
Reviving this thread. Can someone help me understand the price difference between creams and injectables?

For example, Empower sells cream, 200 mg/ml, at 30 ml, for $72. It sells T-cyp 100mg/mL, 5 ml (Compounded), for $55. This doesn't sound right to me, as I've heard injectables are more affordable. How significant is the difference?
Title: Re: Applying Scrotal Cream
Post by: Cataceous on February 06, 2019, 11:41:05 am
Reviving this thread. Can someone help me understand the price difference between creams and injectables?

For example, Empower sells cream, 200 mg/ml, at 30 ml, for $72. It sells T-cyp 100mg/mL, 5 ml (Compounded), for $55. This doesn't sound right to me, as I've heard injectables are more affordable. How significant is the difference?

This is more about brand-name products, where transdermal products like Androgel have outlandish prices compared to injectables, such as Depo-Testosterone. As the transdermal products lose their patents the gaps may narrow.

That aside, in your example the cream is giving you six grams of testosterone, which on normal skin might be equivalent to 600 mg absorbed. With the cypionate you're getting about 350 mg of testosterone. So yes, cream is more economical in this case at $120 per gram versus $157. But Empower is expensive for injectable testosterone. Cash price at Walgreens is $40 for 10 mL of 200 mg/mL T cyp, which means testosterone is only $29 per gram. If you used scrotal application for your Empower cream and got excellent absorption of 60% then the cost drops to $20 per gram. So call it a mixed bag.