Peak Testosterone Forum

General Category => Testosterone, Hormones and General Men's Health => Topic started by: anonymous11 on September 11, 2012, 11:25:31 am

Title: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 11, 2012, 11:25:31 am
Peak T: I had e-mailed you about my husbands low t a while back. Last week he had a testosterone check and you wouldn't believe the results. It was less than 100. I cant believe this and I don't what else to do. The doctor prescribed androgel 1.62%. He quit taking andogel 1% a few days before to lower the results on purpose (he took this for 1 year prior).

Anyway, he is currently taking crestor for high cholesterol and I noticed when he started taking it, everything went down hill. Lately I been on him to eat better and work out. He has been doing great. No more ambien, no beers, only wine once in a while. Do you think It be ok to get him to stop taking crestor? I mean if he works out and eats right, where would the plaque come from? I just hate this pill for everything. He is also taking fish oil a few times a day, ginkgo biloba, he drinks cocoa. Also, he takes Zoloft for depression and is still depressed. What are your thoughts?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 11, 2012, 11:47:42 am
Peak T: I had e-mailed you about my husbands low t a while back. Last week he had a testosterone check and you wouldn't believe the results. It was less than 100. I cant believe this and I don't what else to do. The doctor prescribed androgel 1.62%. He quit taking andogel 1% a few days before to lower the results on purpose (he took this for 1 year prior).

Anyway, he is currently taking crestor for high cholesterol and I noticed when he started taking it, everything went down hill. Lately I been on him to eat better and work out. He has been doing great. No more ambien, no beers, only wine once in a while. Do you think It be ok to get him to stop taking crestor? I mean if he works out and eats right, where would the plaque come from? I just hate this pill for everything. He is also taking fish oil a few times a day, ginkgo biloba, he drinks cocoa. Also, he takes Zoloft for depression and is still depressed. What are your thoughts?

I've just got a sec, but here are few comments:

--With T that low, he needs to be carefully monitored for bone loss, anemaia, low estradiol, etc.

--Crestor can lower testosterone but I doubt that has much to do with his abyssmally low T.  Imo it probably has most to do with 1) Androgel - see comments below - and 2) the fact he quit it.  When you quit HRT, you have a rebound period usually where your testosterone falls even further.  It usually takes months (from what I have seen) for it to normalize to what it was before.

--Our bodies make all the saturated fat that we need.  When we consume extra amounts in the diet, it will send our cholesterol through the roof, especially with a modern lifestyle.  A Low Fat Diet will dramatically reduce his high cholesterol without using pharaceuticals.  Almost everyone I know who has gone on a true, whole foods Low fat Diet has pushed their cholesterol below 150.

--Please use the search for Androgel above on the forum.  You will see issue after issue with it being poorly absorbed and men's testosterone actually decreasing from being on it.

--Gingko can react with some medications.  Get all supplements checked with your doc.

--As I think we've discussed, low testosterone can definitely contribute and even initiate depression in men.  You know his history, but this is certainly not helping things.  The sword can cut the other way as well:  depression can increase cortisol which will tend to lower testosterone through a variety of pathways.

--You must get your doctor to monitor your husband very regularly.  There is no way he should have testosterone that low after a year of HRT.  This should have been diagnosed and discovered by your doctor within a few months of him giving him Androgel.  Then a different delivery method could have been explored that would definitely boost his testosterone. 

Pellets, injections, (well-written) compounding and patches all usually work from what I have seen.  Arimidex and Clomid would probably work.  The point is that there are many ways to go and your husband needs to be monitored frequently until this a solution is actually achieved.

--If I remember right, your husband has quite severe depression.  SSRI's by themselves have not done well in the studies and have many sexual dysfunction issues as you probably know.  However, I have read that many knowledgeable doctors are now combine them with SNRI's, atypicals, triclyclics, etc. to achieve much better results.  However, all of these require experimentation with the patient, have side effects, etc.

--Be sure that is not even marginally hypothyroid.  Hypothyroidism will put the accelerator on many mental conditions including depression.  It also can lower testosterone.  (Get his Vitamin D checked if you have not as well.)

And I wish you all the best, btw, as this sounds like a very tough situation. 





Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: bubba29 on September 11, 2012, 12:03:33 pm
first, this is not medical advice, it is only my well educated opinion i am sharing.

25% of the cholesterol in the body is located in the brain.  cholesterol is a precursor to the production of testosterone.  it is no surprise that after using cholesterol lowering drugs called statins that your husband would have the problems he is having.  he is probably having muscle pains and weakness too. 

statins have yet to be proven to reduce heart attacks in people who have not already had a heart attack.  it has been speculated their most effective action is reduction in inflammation.  sugars and grains tend to be inlammatory.  fish and veggies are anti inflammatory.  i would encourage your husband to check for inflammation in a test called a c reactive protein test.  also, i would check his A1C level.  this gives a good picture of blood sugar levels.  diabetes risk is also increased by statins. 

to muddy up the waters even more, "high" cholesterol is a poor indicator for heart disease risk.  another post on this board was by a man who had cholesterol of ~120 and still had several heart attacks.  watch this video to determine whether the risks of taking crestor are worth it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i8SSCNaaDcE&feature=player_embedded

you 2 may want to check out a review of an interesting book here.
http://www.fathead-movie.com/index.php/2012/09/06/book-review-dont-die-early/ (http://www.fathead-movie.com/index.php/2012/09/06/book-review-dont-die-early/)
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 11, 2012, 12:15:00 pm

statins have yet to be proven to reduce heart attacks in people who have not already had a heart attack.  it has been speculated their most effective action is reduction in inflammation.  sugars and grains tend to be inlammatory.  fish and veggies are anti inflammatory.  i would encourage your husband to check for inflammation in a test called a c reactive protein test.  also, i would check his A1C level.  this gives a good picture of blood sugar levels.  diabetes risk is also increased by statins. 

Couldn't agree more.

to muddy up the waters even more, "high" cholesterol is a poor indicator for heart disease risk.  another post on this board was by a man who had cholesterol of ~120 and still had several heart attacks.  watch this video to determine whether the risks of taking crestor are worth it:


Couldn't agree less.  Why?  Because men in modern societies generally do not live perfectly.  Many studies have shown that hyperlipidemia is a huge problem as you well know.  So how can you say that high cholesterol is not a problem?  Of course, it is a problem for those with additional issue and most men do have those additional issues.

In addition, cholesterol will be a big problem for those with significant inflammation.  Many, if not most, of the men on this board have inflammation issues.  They are learning to get their inflammation under control but are not there yet.

You are also not cautioning them that an Atikins-esque Diet will actually increase their inflammatory levels:

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Atkins_Low_Carb_Diet.aspx

Wonder why Atkins Diets are not nearly as popular any more?  It's because several studies have shown that they elevate your archenemy:  inflammation.

So you're leaving out all the details that could make or break a man's health.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: bubba29 on September 11, 2012, 12:50:45 pm

statins have yet to be proven to reduce heart attacks in people who have not already had a heart attack.  it has been speculated their most effective action is reduction in inflammation.  sugars and grains tend to be inlammatory.  fish and veggies are anti inflammatory.  i would encourage your husband to check for inflammation in a test called a c reactive protein test.  also, i would check his A1C level.  this gives a good picture of blood sugar levels.  diabetes risk is also increased by statins. 

Couldn't agree more.

to muddy up the waters even more, "high" cholesterol is a poor indicator for heart disease risk.  another post on this board was by a man who had cholesterol of ~120 and still had several heart attacks.  watch this video to determine whether the risks of taking crestor are worth it:


Couldn't agree less.  Why?  Because men in modern societies generally do not live perfectly.  Many studies have shown that hyperlipidemia is a huge problem as you well know.  So how can you say that high cholesterol is not a problem?  Of course, it is a problem for those with additional issue and most men do have those additional issues.

In addition, cholesterol will be a big problem for those with significant inflammation.  Many, if not most, of the men on this board have inflammation issues.  They are learning to get their inflammation under control but are not there yet.

You are also not cautioning them that an Atikins-esque Diet will actually increase their inflammatory levels:

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Atkins_Low_Carb_Diet.aspx

Wonder why Atkins Diets are not nearly as popular any more?  It's because several studies have shown that they elevate your archenemy:  inflammation.

So you're leaving out all the details that could make or break a man's health.

i am confused, is it about cholesterol or inflammation.  seems you are eluding that the problem is inflammation.  if that is the case, you are right.  to a large part, sat fats have been replaced by mono and poly unsat fats.  these are in the form of seed oils aka, veggie oils (they are not made out of veggies).  the omega 6 oils are very inflammatory also.

regarding low carb diets....you are relying on old data.  the latest data comparing low fat to low carb is favorable for low carb.  this post reviewed 21 such studies from the last 9 years.


[edited by moderator;  Last warning.  This is the 2nd time you have posted non-authority sites that look like spam.]
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 11, 2012, 01:22:22 pm
Low carb may be favorable in some situations for weight loss per a couple of studies.  However, when you are dropping pounds, it really doesn't matter how you eat because inflammation is reduced automatically as far as health goes.

There is also some evidence that there may be advantages for the super obese:

http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa022637
"A Low-Carbohydrate as Compared with a Low-Fat Diet in Severe Obesity"

The problem is once you go back regular calorie levels:  this is when an Atkins Diet gets ugly.

And you keep ignoring this point.  Here is just one of many studies that shows fat slowing down blood flow:

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0002914996007606
"Effect of a Single High-Fat Meal on Endothelial Function in Healthy Subjects"

Who needs decreased blood flow?  Maybe a half-crazed teenage boy, but that's not 99% of the posters on this board.  The rest of us need increased blood flow!
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: bubba29 on September 11, 2012, 01:35:18 pm

statins have yet to be proven to reduce heart attacks in people who have not already had a heart attack.  it has been speculated their most effective action is reduction in inflammation.  sugars and grains tend to be inlammatory.  fish and veggies are anti inflammatory.  i would encourage your husband to check for inflammation in a test called a c reactive protein test.  also, i would check his A1C level.  this gives a good picture of blood sugar levels.  diabetes risk is also increased by statins. 

Couldn't agree more.

to muddy up the waters even more, "high" cholesterol is a poor indicator for heart disease risk.  another post on this board was by a man who had cholesterol of ~120 and still had several heart attacks.  watch this video to determine whether the risks of taking crestor are worth it:


Couldn't agree less.  Why?  Because men in modern societies generally do not live perfectly.  Many studies have shown that hyperlipidemia is a huge problem as you well know.  So how can you say that high cholesterol is not a problem?  Of course, it is a problem for those with additional issue and most men do have those additional issues.

In addition, cholesterol will be a big problem for those with significant inflammation.  Many, if not most, of the men on this board have inflammation issues.  They are learning to get their inflammation under control but are not there yet.

You are also not cautioning them that an Atikins-esque Diet will actually increase their inflammatory levels:

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Atkins_Low_Carb_Diet.aspx

Wonder why Atkins Diets are not nearly as popular any more?  It's because several studies have shown that they elevate your archenemy:  inflammation.

So you're leaving out all the details that could make or break a man's health.

i am confused, is it about cholesterol or inflammation.  seems you are eluding that the problem is inflammation.  if that is the case, you are right.  to a large part, sat fats have been replaced by mono and poly unsat fats.  these are in the form of seed oils aka, veggie oils (they are not made out of veggies).  the omega 6 oils are very inflammatory also.

regarding low carb diets....you are relying on old data.  the latest data comparing low fat to low carb is favorable for low carb.  this post reviewed 21 such studies from the last 9 years.


[edited by moderator;  Last warning.  This is the 2nd time you have posted non-authority sites that look like spam.]

I am confused, why can you use links like this:
http://www.daphnezuniga.net/environment/mercury.php

but i use a link that compiles 21 clinical trials and it is censored.  i will post data points from the censored post.


(http://www.kriskris.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/weightloss-smaller.jpg)

blue is low carb, red is low fat.  bigger bar equals greater weight loss.

(http://www.kriskris.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/hdl-smaller.jpg)

low carb seems to raise HDL more often.

(http://www.kriskris.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/triglycerides-smaller.jpg)

low carb lowers triglycerides (blood fat) to a much greater extent.

here is an excerpt from the article i could not link:

Low-carb, ketogenic diets are superior to low-fat diets, not only when it comes to weight loss but also in improving pretty much all the major risk factors for western disease.

The results of the studies above all point to low-carb diets being superior when compared to low-fat diets. This is especially prominent for obese individuals, diabetics and those with the metabolic syndrome.

Low-carb diets lead to much more weight loss than the standard of care, low-fat calorie restricted diets, without causing hunger. This is important, because being hungry all the time has a significant effect on quality of life and is hard to sustain.

Low-carb diets also improve other risk factors for disease further than low-fat diets, especially Triglycerides, HDL and LDL pattern.

Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 11, 2012, 01:55:25 pm
Vitamin D level is great. Do you know if high cholesterol is genetic? What kind of injection? Be specific about other treatment options. Do you mean testim shots? What should he ask the doctor for? Also, should he stop taking androgel? Maybe going down to zero will wake the doctors. In the first post, I stated that he quit taking the androgel for a few days before the test. I don't think it really lowered his levels. Even when he took it for a year, the results are the same. Androgel just doesn't work for him.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: bubba29 on September 11, 2012, 02:11:43 pm
Vitamin D level is great. Do you know if high cholesterol is genetic? What kind of injection? Be specific about other treatment options. Do you mean testim shots? What should he ask the doctor for? Also, should he stop taking androgel? Maybe going down to zero will wake the doctors. In the first post, I stated that he quit taking the androgel for a few days before the test. I don't think it really lowered his levels. Even when he took it for a year, the results are the same. Androgel just doesn't work for him.

for the most part cholesterol levels are not hereditary.  there is something that is called familial hypercholesterolemia which is typically reserved for numbers above 300 that cannot be managed by diet.  it is a pretty rare condition.

genetics is an interesting topic.  do certain activities and consume certain foods and your body will react to this stimulation in a certain way.  we are not hard coded with a destiny to die of cancer or heart disease for example.  this is called epigenetics and it is the bodies way of adjusting to certain stimuli.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 11, 2012, 03:13:34 pm
Vitamin D level is great. Do you know if high cholesterol is genetic?
Some guys are VERY sensitive to saturated fat.  I have known a number of men with cholsterol in the 250+ range who dramatically lowered cholseterol when they went low fat for example. 

What kind of injection? Be specific about other treatment options. Do you mean testim shots? What should he ask the doctor for?
Here is the key with injections:  you want a doc that will give them (ideally) once per week as you start out high and end up low.  Here are just a few of the many links on the forum and the site about this topic:

http://peaktestosterone.com/forum/index.php?topic=424.0
http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Interview_Testopel_Testosterone_Pellets.aspx
http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Compounding_Testosterone.aspx
http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Bioidentical_Testosterone.aspx

As far as I know, it's pretty much urologists that do Testopel and not everyone is covered on insurance.

Hope that helps.

Also, should he stop taking androgel? Maybe going down to zero will wake the doctors. In the first post, I stated that he quit taking the androgel for a few days before the test. I don't think it really lowered his levels. Even when he took it for a year, the results are the same. Androgel just doesn't work for him.

Very low testosterone is potentially dangerous.  Again, it can lead to anemia and osteopenia/osteoporosis.  This needs to be looked at asap.

You're right:  it probably didn't lower them much.  I know you did what you thought you had to do but the key is to find a doctor that is knowledgeable not game the system.  Again, not finding fault with you, but I'm just saying that because it's VERY important you find a physician who understands men's health issues.  I'm not seeing a lot of signs that this office does!

By the way, you should not have to even debate whether or not he is hypogonadal.  LabCorb's bottom range is about 360 ng/dl now and the other big labs are in the 260-280 range.  Your husband is hypogonadal by any standard I know of.

Only a physician can and should prescribe medications and I can't give you advice on the subject.  but you definitely have a right to demand why their definition of hypogonadal excludes someone with such low levels, ask for a 2nd opinion, etc.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: bubba29 on September 12, 2012, 09:50:42 am
Vitamin D level is great. Do you know if high cholesterol is genetic? What kind of injection? Be specific about other treatment options. Do you mean testim shots? What should he ask the doctor for? Also, should he stop taking androgel? Maybe going down to zero will wake the doctors. In the first post, I stated that he quit taking the androgel for a few days before the test. I don't think it really lowered his levels. Even when he took it for a year, the results are the same. Androgel just doesn't work for him.

http://video.foxnews.com/v/1503058626001/
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 12, 2012, 11:12:05 am
Bubba:

Just saw this video. Great information and thanks. We all know some of these medications are a waste of time. I am researching zoloft to see how much of a help it is. I have noticed his problems going down hill after taking zoloft.

Peak T:

I just called his first doctor who was initially treating him to make an appointment with him. For some reason, he decided to see this other doctor who sucks. She seems to think 250 testosterone level is ideal for someone his age. Those were her goals, to get him to 250. She said any more would make him aggressive. I will go with him to this appointment. He seems to let them run him around.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 12, 2012, 11:26:58 am
She seems to think 250 testosterone level is ideal for someone his age. Those were her goals, to get him to 250. She said any more would make him aggressive.

That would be hilarious if it wasn't someone's life and health at stake!

So she wants to neuter your husband in order to make him less aggressive.

The irony is that the opposite is true.  Many animal and a couple of human studies have shown that males with abundant testosterone levels are more relaxed and less likely to fight.  Lower testosterone males are actually the ones getting in the fights.

When all your neurotransmitters have been sucked out of your brain, your nitric oxide levels have decreased, your insulin levels are rising, and the internals of your penis are literally withering - well, it can make you just a little bit crabby!
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: bubba29 on September 12, 2012, 12:02:12 pm
She seems to think 250 testosterone level is ideal for someone his age. Those were her goals, to get him to 250. She said any more would make him aggressive.


When all your neurotransmitters have been sucked out of your brain, your nitric oxide levels have decreased, your insulin levels are rising, and the internals of your penis are literally withering - well, it can make you just a little bit crabby!

funny you bring up neurotransmitters in the brain because that is one of the functions cholesterol helps with.

Research by an Iowa State University scientist due to be published this month in the journal Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences indicates that cholesterol-lowering drugs (statins) may lessen brain function.

The results of the study show that drugs that inhibit the liver from making cholesterol may also keep the brain from making cholesterol, which is vital to efficient brain function.

“If you deprive cholesterol from the brain, then you directly affect the machinery that triggers the release of neurotransmitters,”, said Yeon-Kyun Shin, the lead researcher. “Neurotransmitters affect the data-processing and memory functions. In other words – how smart you are and how well you remember things.”

Cholesterol is abundant in the tissue of the brain and nervous system. Myelin, which covers nerve axons to help conduct the electrical impulses that make movement, sensation, thinking, learning, and remembering possible, is over one fifth cholesterol by weight. Even though the brain only makes up 2% of the body’s weight, it contains 25% of its cholesterol.

We now know that the formation of synapses, or connections between neurons, is directly dependent on the availability of cholesterol.


“If you try to lower the cholesterol by taking medicine that is attacking the machinery of cholesterol synthesis in the liver, that medicine goes to the brain too. And then it reduces the synthesis of cholesterol which is necessary in the brain,” said Shin.

http://chriskresser.com/cholesterol-lowering-drugs-reduce-brain-function
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 12, 2012, 12:07:27 pm
He is 33
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: bubba29 on September 12, 2012, 12:19:43 pm
He is 33

wow, that is awfully young to have all that going on and be on all that medication.  has he had any other health issues in the past?  does he have any other health conditions not already mentioned in this thread?  is he active? how is his stress?  how is his body composition?
here is a blogpost that is very pertinent: http://escapetheherdblog.blogspot.com/2010/10/are-you-driver-or-just-passenger.html


here is an interesting book review you may want to check out.  book is simply called "Don't Die Early".  I have nothing to do with it or the site but it may help.  http://www.fathead-movie.com/index.php/2012/09/06/book-review-dont-die-early/

insightfull health and wellness books i've read are The Braintrust Program,  The Great Cholesterol Con, Protein Power, Paleo Solution, The Primal Blueprint, and Trick and Treat
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 12, 2012, 01:04:47 pm
I know, he is way too young for this. He is active, but works in an office so that doesn't help. In the past he took lots of pain pills and did stupid things occasionally. Maybe it contributed to his problems, who knows. He looks normal and is in great shape.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 12, 2012, 01:15:07 pm
He looks normal and is in great shape.

And he's young.  That's huge.  It's remarkable what you can do to your body before about age 35 and bounce back very rapidly...

Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 12, 2012, 06:21:55 pm
Peak T:

My husband had the nerves to tell me that I contributed to his problems. He said I caused him a lot of stress. Of course It's stressful, I am not going to be quiet and let this be. I am only 29 and I'm not going to make him feel like things are always ok. Sometimes I try to be patient, but most times I have something to say because I am constantly trying to find info on how to help him. Maybe I could blame him for stressing me out. This is personal, even with everything, I still initiate you know what almost every single night. I just don't want him to go dead. Even after he makes me feel like nothing, I am strong enough to get up and try again. How could I be the blame? What about single guys, who dropped their testosterone? Make no damn sense. I will keep trying to help him.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 12, 2012, 09:02:09 pm
Well, you know how that goes:  what a person says is not what he means and my guess is that this is the case here.  He's basically saying - I'm not there of course so I admit this is wild speculation actually - "Back off.  I'm not dealing with that now."

Let me mention a profound but sad truth:  sometimes guys will not change without a 2 X 4.  Most guys that I know that have improved their health is not through a steely discipline or a lover of their family, but rather from some major health trauma that forced them to change.  It's sad but very true.

It sounds like you did get your husband to change a few things, so that's very admirable.  But, if he doesn't do it himself, how long will it last?  If you've really tried and done all you can, what else can you really do?  To me it sounds like he's saying, "You can't make me.  I'm not changing now." 

I guess what I'm encouraging you to do, and I've mentioned this before, is to take care of yourself.  Do the best you can with your husband, but watch after your own health and well-being.  Watching a loved one injure him or herself is very painful and disturbing, especially for women. 

Again, you've got to focus on stress reduction, cortisol management and positive outlets for yourself to make sure you don't get injured as well.  What good is it going to do for both of you to be out of commission?

By the way, I don't mean to sound gloom and doom.  Men can and will change.  But it seems to take a pivotal event for them generally.  Just look at this forum.  Most men arrived here because they have erectile dysfunction and related issues.  And many of them are now exercising, eating healthy and greatly improving their health.  Sometimes you gotta hit us where it counts I'm afraid...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 13, 2012, 04:44:21 am
He did basically say "you cant make me and I am not changing now" He even told me he wants me to suffer because of his problems, only when I make him feel like dirt about it. He definitely blames me for this.

What wife wouldn't be upset after being rejected so many times? I am not the easiest person to deal with, but I know one thing for sure. I love my husband and I am trying to help him. I think he tries a lot in his eyes, but it's not enough for me. I see no results and it's upsetting. Like I said before, I am not giving up. I have a husband who hates me and now his doctors will soon hate me too.
I am secure enough to not care about being blamed for someone else's medical problems. I could take blame for causing him stress but don't be so stupid to blame me for lowering your testosterone.

I blame his mom, how does that sound? that's just as crazy as him blaming me.

This website is awesome. Thanks Peak T for allowing people to share information on this topic.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: bubba29 on September 13, 2012, 08:03:46 am
Peak T:

My husband had the nerves to tell me that I contributed to his problems. He said I caused him a lot of stress. Of course It's stressful, I am not going to be quiet and let this be. I am only 29 and I'm not going to make him feel like things are always ok. Sometimes I try to be patient, but most times I have something to say because I am constantly trying to find info on how to help him. Maybe I could blame him for stressing me out. This is personal, even with everything, I still initiate you know what almost every single night. I just don't want him to go dead. Even after he makes me feel like nothing, I am strong enough to get up and try again. How could I be the blame? What about single guys, who dropped their testosterone? Make no damn sense. I will keep trying to help him.

it is sad but i know way more people that would prefer to pop pills than make any real, effective changes.  pills do not fix the underlying problem(s), they only mask the symptoms.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 13, 2012, 09:19:41 am
He did basically say "you cant make me and I am not changing now" He even told me he wants me to suffer because of his problems, only when I make him feel like dirt about it. He definitely blames me for this.

What wife wouldn't be upset after being rejected so many times? I am not the easiest person to deal with, but I know one thing for sure. I love my husband and I am trying to help him. I think he tries a lot in his eyes, but it's not enough for me. I see no results and it's upsetting. Like I said before, I am not giving up. I have a husband who hates me and now his doctors will soon hate me too.
I am secure enough to not care about being blamed for someone else's medical problems. I could take blame for causing him stress but don't be so stupid to blame me for lowering your testosterone.

I blame his mom, how does that sound? that's just as crazy as him blaming me.

This website is awesome. Thanks Peak T for allowing people to share information on this topic.

Sorry to hear about all of this of course.  I'll just say the obvious again:  it's very painful to watch someone destroy their health.  Furthermore, it affects family and friends since it can affect finances, sex lives, relationships and mental health.

But the reality is that it is extremely common.  Your husband's case is very blatant, but the great majority of Westerners do the same thing with poor diet, being sedentary, smoking, excessive alcohol and on and on. 

Let me ask this:  how many of your husband's friends and family are the picture of health and fitness?  Probably almost no one.  Often men have no models around them and even associate poor health habits (drinking, drugs, sitting around, etc.) with manliness.  It's very dysfunctional but true...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: bubba29 on September 13, 2012, 09:49:52 am
He did basically say "you cant make me and I am not changing now" He even told me he wants me to suffer because of his problems, only when I make him feel like dirt about it. He definitely blames me for this.

What wife wouldn't be upset after being rejected so many times? I am not the easiest person to deal with, but I know one thing for sure. I love my husband and I am trying to help him. I think he tries a lot in his eyes, but it's not enough for me. I see no results and it's upsetting. Like I said before, I am not giving up. I have a husband who hates me and now his doctors will soon hate me too.
I am secure enough to not care about being blamed for someone else's medical problems. I could take blame for causing him stress but don't be so stupid to blame me for lowering your testosterone.

I blame his mom, how does that sound? that's just as crazy as him blaming me.

This website is awesome. Thanks Peak T for allowing people to share information on this topic.

Sorry to hear about all of this of course.  I'll just say the obvious again:  it's very painful to watch someone destroy their health.  Furthermore, it affects family and friends since it can affect finances, sex lives, relationships and mental health.

But the reality is that it is extremely common.  Your husband's case is very blatant, but the great majority of Westerners do the same thing with poor diet, being sedentary, smoking, excessive alcohol and on and on. 

Let me ask this:  how many of your husband's friends and family are the picture of health and fitness?  Probably almost no one.  Often men have no models around them and even associate poor health habits (drinking, drugs, sitting around, etc.) with manliness.  It's very dysfunctional but true...

i concur.  seems men care more about the appearance of their cars and yards than their own body.  it frustrates the hell out of me but it is what it is.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 13, 2012, 12:03:33 pm
I think he should be here seeking help. I didn't get sleep last night worrying about him. Time to focus on myself. I have to share a story. My sister's boyfriend did blood work the other day and his cholesterol was very high. The doctor tried to write him a prescription and he refused. Now he works out every day and is very determined to get better without medication. He told the doctor give me 3 months and I should be ok. I am proud of people like him. Not that my husband intentionally tried to hurt himself. He just didn't know about side effects, but now he does.  So here is the plan.

I am going to let him take the anti-depressants for now, temporarily or until his levels get back up and he feels better.

As for the crestor, I told him to quit taking it for 3 months. Let me cook something healthy every day, no drinking, eating out, medications and of course work out every single day. Then get tested to see if he improved. Maybe test once a month. He agreed and then accused me of wanting him to be dead without his medication. I don't even rate 3 months to make my husband healthier, but his doctor gets to ruin his life by writing a prescription. I might as well feed him junk and ruin him even more.

What do you guys think about the plan to lower cholesterol? Don't you think I deserve a chance? I get to be healthy too. Its a win win situation. Lee, I will never forget what you said, you told me:

"Sometimes people get tired of being miserable"

I share this with him all the time and one day I think he will get tired of it. I do think its an American thing. A pill for everything. They get enough sex from tv, computer, magazines, strangers but not their own wives. Time to find an older guy. They seem to think more about health, because they have to keep up with someone like me lol. Please do not get offended anyone reading this. This is real life stuff and I get to vent out anonymously.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 13, 2012, 12:16:00 pm
His family is not close, but I think they are healthy people overall. They work out, but they all drink a lot. My husband was in the best shape when we first met. He is all about working out etc... But lately medication seems to work better for him. He did drugs occasionally after we met and a whole lot in the past.

I could find him a new role model since he doesn't have one close by. Another man should do the trick. He would shape his ass up in a hurry. But I am not like that. I am stubborn and determined to make my marriage work. I will give it another year so I don't feel like a quitter.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: bubba29 on September 13, 2012, 12:29:23 pm
I think he should be here seeking help. I didn't get sleep last night worrying about him. Time to focus on myself. I have to share a story. My sister's boyfriend did blood work the other day and his cholesterol was very high. The doctor tried to write him a prescription and he refused. Now he works out every day and is very determined to get better without medication. He told the doctor give me 3 months and I should be ok. I am proud of people like him. Not that my husband intentionally tried to hurt himself. He just didn't know about side effects, but now he does.  So here is the plan.

I am going to let him take the anti-depressants for now, temporarily or until his levels get back up and he feels better.

As for the crestor, I told him to quit taking it for 3 months. Let me cook something healthy every day, no drinking, eating out, medications and of course work out every single day. Then get tested to see if he improved. Maybe test once a month. He agreed and then accused me of wanting him to be dead without his medication. I don't even rate 3 months to make my husband healthier, but his doctor gets to ruin his life by writing a prescription. I might as well feed him junk and ruin him even more.

What do you guys think about the plan to lower cholesterol? Don't you think I deserve a chance? I get to be healthy too. Its a win win situation. Lee, I will never forget what you said, you told me:

"Sometimes people get tired of being miserable"

I share this with him all the time and one day I think he will get tired of it. I do think its an American thing. A pill for everything. They get enough sex from tv, computer, magazines, strangers but not their own wives. Time to find an older guy. They seem to think more about health, because they have to keep up with someone like me lol. Please do not get offended anyone reading this. This is real life stuff and I get to vent out anonymously.

i would also get his CRP tested and A1C tested if it hasn't already been done.  he may have more going on than "high" cholesterol.  what are his triglycerides?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 13, 2012, 12:46:41 pm
What are those? I think everything might be normal. Is this the same test for a routine check up. I will have to ask him about that.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 13, 2012, 03:17:22 pm
From what I understand fasting insulin is actually more reliable at detecting insulin resistance.  Here are more tests to consider at some point:

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/testosterone_tests.aspx
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 13, 2012, 04:09:21 pm
Hello everyone. I am here in the house looking at my wife's forum that she started. I read the entire thing. My triglycerides are in the normal range. I tried the whole eating right and exercising regularly on a daily basis without any medication a couple years back after I found my HDL and LDL cholesterol was at high risk for heart disease with terrible numbers to show for it. When I was doing everything right, my cholesterol was still horrible. I tried Simvastatin and had terribly high CK levels so doc changed me to Crestor. As soon as I took that, my levels lowered. I never made any changes except medicine and it went to normal. My mom and family have a history of high cholesterol. What am I supposed to do? I tried it all. It is very discouraging. Then in the last year, I get slapped in the face with low T. This month it was 72. What the heck do you all want me to do? I work out now regularly and do care, however, I now feel my brain with 100 pound weights inside it. I ran 2 miles today to see if I can sweat out my 100 pound weight inside my brain.Don't only look at my wife's words without hearing my story. I will try to stop Crestor for 3 months and then do a cholesterol test and see where I am. I will give that a shot. My urologist is horrible. They will not give me anything stronger than Androgel. I guess they want me to have a 0 score and practically a walking zombie to get something better. I feel super depressed now. It is major. 50 mg of Sentraline(generic Zoloft) is not cutting it. I am rolling downhill fast right now. I am making the adjustments but lets be truthful....I have done the right things in the past but it leads me right back into where I am at right now.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: bubba29 on September 13, 2012, 04:31:35 pm
Hello everyone. I am here in the house looking at my wife's forum that she started. I read the entire thing. My triglycerides are in the normal range. I tried the whole eating right and exercising regularly on a daily basis without any medication a couple years back after I found my HDL and LDL cholesterol was at high risk for heart disease with terrible numbers to show for it. When I was doing everything right, my cholesterol was still horrible. I tried Simvastatin and had terribly high CK levels so doc changed me to Crestor. As soon as I took that, my levels lowered. I never made any changes except medicine and it went to normal. My mom and family have a history of high cholesterol. What am I supposed to do? I tried it all. It is very discouraging. Then in the last year, I get slapped in the face with low T. This month it was 72. What the heck do you all want me to do? I work out now regularly and do care, however, I now feel my brain with 100 pound weights inside it. I ran 2 miles today to see if I can sweat out my 100 pound weight inside my brain.Don't only look at my wife's words without hearing my story. I will try to stop Crestor for 3 months and then do a cholesterol test and see where I am. I will give that a shot. My urologist is horrible. They will not give me anything stronger than Androgel. I guess they want me to have a 0 score and practically a walking zombie to get something better. I feel super depressed now. It is major. 50 mg of Sentraline(generic Zoloft) is not cutting it. I am rolling downhill fast right now. I am making the adjustments but lets be truthful....I have done the right things in the past but it leads me right back into where I am at right now.

i am sure you have done what you are told.  problem is the typical prescription is based on bad science.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kWZq0bx8cXA&feature=plcp
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v8WA5wcaHp4&feature=plcp
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 13, 2012, 08:59:41 pm
Hello everyone. I am here in the house looking at my wife's forum that she started. I read the entire thing. My triglycerides are in the normal range. I tried the whole eating right and exercising regularly on a daily basis without any medication a couple years back after I found my HDL and LDL cholesterol was at high risk for heart disease with terrible numbers to show for it. When I was doing everything right, my cholesterol was still horrible. I tried Simvastatin and had terribly high CK levels so doc changed me to Crestor. As soon as I took that, my levels lowered. I never made any changes except medicine and it went to normal. My mom and family have a history of high cholesterol. What am I supposed to do? I tried it all. It is very discouraging. Then in the last year, I get slapped in the face with low T. This month it was 72. What the heck do you all want me to do? I work out now regularly and do care, however, I now feel my brain with 100 pound weights inside it. I ran 2 miles today to see if I can sweat out my 100 pound weight inside my brain.Don't only look at my wife's words without hearing my story. I will try to stop Crestor for 3 months and then do a cholesterol test and see where I am. I will give that a shot. My urologist is horrible. They will not give me anything stronger than Androgel. I guess they want me to have a 0 score and practically a walking zombie to get something better. I feel super depressed now. It is major. 50 mg of Sentraline(generic Zoloft) is not cutting it. I am rolling downhill fast right now. I am making the adjustments but lets be truthful....I have done the right things in the past but it leads me right back into where I am at right now.

Well, thx for coming on.  My testosterone was never as low as yours but I got down into the upper 200's and that was miserable.  And young guys tend to be affected more from what I've seen, so I cannot imagine what you are going through.

Let me jump to the most important thing.  You wrote "They will not give me anything stronger than Androgel".  I urge you to use the search at the top right of this forum and put in Androgel.  You will come across story after story of men who actually had their already low testosterone lowered further by Androgel.  It doesn't make sense, but it's very common.  It is by far the most common "side effect" complaint that I get regarding HRT.

The next important point:  there are many inexpensive options (injections, compounding) that will raise your testosterone if done right.  [Patches work well for some guys and sometimes Axiron and Foresta, but imho you should go for delivery methods with highest percentage of success.]  Pellets also work well, but are expensive and not all insurance providers cover it.  So there is no reason that your doctors cannot get your testosterone level up other than ignorance or laziness. 

And I'm not done with important points yet - here's another:  testosterone below about 350 ng/dl is associated with increased risk for MANY nasty conditions:  heart disease, arterial plaque, diabetes, metabolic syndrome, high blood pressure, depression, anxiety, erectile dysfunction - this list could go on and on.

But you get the idea:  having low testosterone actually increases your risk for many dangerous conditions?  Why?  Because it lowers nitric oxide, increase insulin and hammers your neurotransmitter and red blood cells just for starters.  It also withers the inside of your penis - yes, quite literally!

And it's not just long term issues but short term as well.  It is very likely that with testosterone that low you are anemic and that your estrogen is low enough to where you are experiencing net bone loss.  Did your doctor test your estrogen?  I doubt it!  Did your doctor do an RBC (red blood cell count)?  It doesn't sound like it.

So you guys have to do what you think is right, but you must push your doctor, get a new doctor or get a 2nd or 3rd opinion.  Something needs to happen as your doctor is not even monitoring you.  I don't know your medical history, so maybe your doctor has some obscure reason for not wanting to raise your testosterone, but this is generally only an issue for men with existing prostate cancer.  So you need to get on this asap and figure out what is going on.

I'm going to have to stop here - I have much more to write - but here is another MAJOR point:  low testosterone is brutally hard on the male brain.  Right now your testosterone is not that much greater than your wife's.  Your brain needs the opposite.  Read the recent thread that starry posted:  researchers just found out that exercise literally rebuild the brain by raising cerebral testosterone levels! 

When your testosterone gets low enough, you are extremely vulnerable to anxiety, depression, mental fog.  As I pointed out earlier, low testosterone - not high - have been shown in the research to be the ones most likely to fight.  Why?  Cuzz they feel like ^#*$!

Again, I'm not a doc, so I can't really advise you on medication, but get informed and don't let a doctor destroy your life, your brain/career/relationships simply because he/she is too ignorant or lazy to read the latest research.  Also, I will be more than happy to send you my testosterone book for free - just PM me if that is of interest.

Please ask more questions and make comments, but I've got to run - family stuff...

Hang in there and get your life back! 
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 14, 2012, 10:07:01 am
I am looking at his blood work right now and the RBC is 5.47. Don't know where the estrogen levels are. Do you know how it's abbreviated? Also, what do you think about the RBC?

Also, his doctor did want to raise the T level. His goal was over 700. The last visit they let him see the PA and that's when she ordered blood work again and decided that under a 100 wasn't too bad. I cant wait to get a hold of them today. I will embarrass the hell out of that office. I also want him to go back to the first doctor and if he doesn't help, then screw them. We will find another one and then report their lousy practice. Keep you posted.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 14, 2012, 01:43:30 pm
I am looking at his blood work right now and the RBC is 5.47. Don't know where the estrogen levels are. Do you know how it's abbreviated? Also, what do you think about the RBC?

Also, his doctor did want to raise the T level. His goal was over 700. The last visit they let him see the PA and that's when she ordered blood work again and decided that under a 100 wasn't too bad. I cant wait to get a hold of them today. I will embarrass the hell out of that office. I also want him to go back to the first doctor and if he doesn't help, then screw them. We will find another one and then report their lousy practice. Keep you posted.

Look at the range on the RBC.  Don't remember off the top of my head.

He probably did not pull estradiol.  Btw, I was mostly making a point with the estradiol.  If the doc really does push your husband up near 700, his estradiol will ramp up with it.  However, if for some reason, your husband's T stays low, almost for sure his E2 will be low. 

Read this if you haven't as to why this is a concern over time:

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Do_Men_Need_Estrogen.aspx
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 19, 2012, 03:05:56 pm
Hello everyone. This is husband here. I have some hopeful news. I just got out of an appointment from a 2nd opinion. I am getting 200mg testosterone injections prescription on a weekly basis. I will self inject. I hope this helps me out. This is only a one month prescription. I will follow up with blood work and an appointment at the end of the month. The 100 pound weight in my head feels like 200 pounds now. I am forgetting things that I am doing. I have been working out daily by running and weight training. I work out in the mornngs around 530 am for an hour. I been eating right. I take ginkgo bilobo for memory, vitamin B and D, melatonin at night, cocoa, fish oil and I stopped taking Crestor. I need to stay on Zoloft until my testosterone gets back up. I cannot stop that medicine until I feel better. I am doing everything I can. Any thoughts on what I said?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 19, 2012, 04:56:00 pm
Everyone, this is me again. I just injected my 1st dose of testosterone cypionate 200mg. Only $10 with insurance for the month...Way better price than androgel....I am praying that I feel some changes in the next couple days. Does anyone have any advice on the testosterone cypionate? Should I ask for Nolvadex next month to be safe to block estrogen buildup? I do not have a clue how this stuff will affect me but with 72 score of testosterone at 33 years old, I am ready to try anything.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 19, 2012, 07:43:02 pm
Hello everyone. This is husband here. I have some hopeful news. I just got out of an appointment from a 2nd opinion. I am getting 200mg testosterone injections prescription on a weekly basis. I will self inject. I hope this helps me out. This is only a one month prescription. I will follow up with blood work and an appointment at the end of the month. The 100 pound weight in my head feels like 200 pounds now. I am forgetting things that I am doing. I have been working out daily by running and weight training. I work out in the mornngs around 530 am for an hour. I been eating right. I take ginkgo bilobo for memory, vitamin B and D, melatonin at night, cocoa, fish oil and I stopped taking Crestor. I need to stay on Zoloft until my testosterone gets back up. I cannot stop that medicine until I feel better. I am doing everything I can. Any thoughts on what I said?

That's great about the weekly injections.  I feel certain that this will make a big difference for you.    Most guys notice mental and libido improvements pretty quickly, but there are no guarantees as to timing of course.  You should notice nice, steady improvmenet over the months. 

Now I do have to say that occasionally men will not feel that much difference.  This is usually because of high estradiol or some other health issue.  However, in your case, your testosterone was so low that I feel certain this is going to be a nice change for you.

And congrats on the lifestyle improvements!  You're definitely on the right track here and, again, I think you're going to see big improvements as the months roll on.  Usually men feel so good that they never want to go back to "the old ways". 
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 19, 2012, 07:49:43 pm
Should I ask for Nolvadex next month to be safe to block estrogen buildup? 

Ask to be tested.  You don't want estrogen too high or low:

http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2010/may2010_Why-Estrogen-Balance-is-Critical-to-Aging-Men_01.htm

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Do_Men_Need_Estrogen.aspx
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Quincy on September 20, 2012, 07:43:25 am
Everyone, this is me again. I just injected my 1st dose of testosterone cypionate 200mg.

I do not have a clue how this stuff will affect me but with 72 score of testosterone at 33 years old, I am ready to try anything.

Do you happen to remember what your T score was before using Androgel and how long ago was that?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 20, 2012, 10:07:59 am
Quincy:

His score was 272 last April. Then he started using Androgel and it went up to 700 a few months after. Later that year, he started feeling depressed and all the low t symptoms started happening. So I am sure the Androgel lowered his score to 72 this year.

Peak:

This morning my husband said he felt like a new man. We will keep everyone posted. I will ask him to retest soon and get the estradiol level. I am curious to know because of his new diet and working out and of course the treatment.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Quincy on September 20, 2012, 11:40:01 am
Quincy:

His score was 272 last April. Then he started using Androgel and it went up to 700 a few months after. Later that year, he started feeling depressed and all the low t symptoms started happening. So I am sure the Androgel lowered his score to 72 this year

That's strange... that he was actually absorbing it in the beginning and then it quit working. 700 is a nice upper range number. First I've heard of Androgel working and working well then stopping.

In any event, 200mg of TC per week is a pretty large dose from what I've read. Will be interesting to see where his levels go being on that regime. Personally I would prefer going that route and adjusting the dosage downward later if his readings are too high.

If he noticed a big improvement overnight, he's likely to see a lot more improvements in the weeks and months to come!

Keep us posted!
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 20, 2012, 11:42:04 am
Then he started using Androgel and it went up to 700 a few months after. Later that year, he started feeling depressed and all the low t symptoms started happening. So I am sure the Androgel lowered his score to 72 this year.


Now that is weird story.  Did you have any reads between the 700 and the 72?  And was the 272 read after the 72?

And congrats on him feeling better!
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 20, 2012, 01:41:54 pm
April 2011  Testosterone -272 Started using Androgel

August 2011- T-700

August 2012- T-72

September 2012- starting new treatment, He will retest at the end of October.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 20, 2012, 01:50:57 pm
Well, that is unusual to say the least.  I don't want to be tedious, but I'm going somewhere with this.  Did your husband ever feel pretty good during the time frame when he was 700, i.e. do you feel like the testosterone helped with his low T symptoms at least for awhile?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Quincy on September 20, 2012, 03:14:37 pm
I do not have a clue how this stuff will affect me but with 72 score of testosterone at 33 years old, I am ready to try anything.

I feel the same way and keep looking for answers to what to expect. I ran across this study today that gives estimated timelines for feeling affects from the TRT. It is a complicated subject, but this is the first study I've come across that tries to answer what to expect. Check it out.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3188848/
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 20, 2012, 03:50:47 pm
Hello all. Its me, the husband here again. I read the comments after mine and I have to tell you, even when I was at 700 taking the androgel, I felt like dirt. I did not feel like that number was legitimate. I have to say that after taking the 200mg injection yesterday, I feel better overnight than I ever was on Androgel the entire year I was taking it. I woke up with a pretty good erection more than I had during sleep for a long time. I went to exercise at 5:30 this morning and I was feeling great in the gym. I lifted stronger than I usually do and felt like an animal. My 100 pound weight was about 40 pounds in the morning and came back of to 85 pounds which is still better than yesterday. Question for all of you: Will L-Carnitine negatively affect me in any way? I just started taking it. 500mg 2 times a day. I sweat real good at the gym this morning. I am hoping tonight I will function like I am half way normal but I do not want to jump the gun....
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 21, 2012, 06:55:33 am
Congrats on feeling better!  My guess is that you increased your testosterone by over 10 X! 

Your readings were so all over the place that I also was wondering about a bad read.  Anyway, another Androgel horror story I guess...

L-Carnitine has a good track record and I don't know of any long term issues with taking reasonable dosages, but talk to your doc as it can interact with some medications, etc.

Here are a couple of interesting pages:

http://www.umm.edu/altmed/articles/carnitine-l-000291.htm

http://www.raysahelian.com/carnitine.html

Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 21, 2012, 03:31:26 pm
Here I am again, the husband. It has been 2 days since the 200mg shot of Testosterone Cypionate. My biggest problem right now is my heavy foggy head. I feel strong and I got more excited recently than I have in a while, but it seems like my head is really cloudy. Does anyone have any knowledge of this heavy weight in my head. I do feel best in the morning but half way through the day the weight in my head just increases. I am sick of my brain feeling like this. Is this something that will get better after a couple more shots in weeks or is this unpredictable. I still on depression meds until I feel 100% better. I know it's not the anti-depressant that is making my head feel like that because it felt like that before I started taking. I am getting really anxious to get my problem cured. Feels almost like a permanent headache. As for the testosterone, my body feels strong but not the mind. Does anyone have experience of when the mind feels better after having less than 100 testosterone reading. Any feedback is greatly appreciated.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 21, 2012, 04:44:05 pm
It is fairly common to really feel "brain remapping" for a few days.  Trust me - this is having a profound impact on your neurotransmitters. Ultimately, it is usually a good thing of course.

However, in your case, it is really tricky because your are on medications, so you've got to run this by a knowledgeable doc. 

Something doesn't seem right based on your description.  It shouldn't be too uncomfortable as far as I know...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 21, 2012, 06:01:34 pm
I already stopped Crestor but when I do my next blood work for T and everything else next month, my future of cholesterol medications rest on that. I want to be sure that if I workout, eat right and do everything MOSTLY right, not take Crestor, then I should have the best cholesterol result without medication. If it comes back high, then I will have no choice except for getting back on it. High cholesterol runs high in my family. I tried this in the past and the end result without meds was high cholesterol. I have high hopes but at the same time realistic due to past experience. The anti-depresents are a must right now, however, I heard Wellbutrin  might be more at an advantage. Please tell me your thoughts.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 22, 2012, 07:16:58 am
You asked a great question and so I split your thread out to here:

http://peaktestosterone.com/forum/index.php?topic=545.0
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 27, 2012, 05:08:16 pm
#2 Testosterone shot injected. I worked out 4 times this week in the mornings. I am gaining muscle weight and getting really strong in the gym. I lifted 40 more pounds on bench press. Strange because 3 weeks ago I had a 72 score for total T and now I feel strong. My mental fog is there but it reduced a lot down. I was able to do it with my wife twice in one day yesterday. Now I know my whole youth before 33 I always had low T and never new. Androgel was garbage and a waste of time. My goal now is once I go back to doc for blood work I will not refill the antidepressants. The T injections saved my life. I still have some ways to go but I feel a lot better and this is just after the 2nd shot of 200mg.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 27, 2012, 05:31:39 pm
I already stopped Crestor but when I do my next blood work for T and everything else next month, my future of cholesterol medications rest on that. I want to be sure that if I workout, eat right and do everything MOSTLY right, not take Crestor, then I should have the best cholesterol result without medication. If it comes back high, then I will have no choice except for getting back on it. High cholesterol runs high in my family. I tried this in the past and the end result without meds was high cholesterol. I have high hopes but at the same time realistic due to past experience. The anti-depresents are a must right now, however, I heard Wellbutrin  might be more at an advantage. Please tell me your thoughts.

Gotcha.

First of all, do a search in the forum on Buproprion and Wellbutrin.  Some guys had great commentary on their experiences and I gave a research summary as well.  There's a lot of great stuff out on the web as well.

Well, I think I said this before, but perhaps not clearly enough:  a Low Fat Diet will drop your cholesterol like a rock.  If you really want to solve low cholesterol, that's the only sure way to do it that I know.  I have never known anyone that went on a true low fat diet that could not get his cholesterol below about 160.  And 160 is not that common.  Most guys can get it below 150. 

One more important comment:  I have heard many times guys say, "High cholesterol runs in my family."  Again, when they go on a true, whole foods Low Fat Diet, they say, "I can't believe my cholesterol dropped that much!"

Now I can't absolutely promise you'll drop below 160, but it's very likely based on what I have seen.  In Esselstyn's book he talks about how almost always he can get the patient below 150 and if he doesn't, then and only then will he give a statin.

Now you may not be interested or open to a Low Fat Diet - I realize that eating is very cultural and downright religious for some people.  I still do not discuss with many family members how I eat as I know they'd think I was crazy. 

Anyway, if you do have an interest, the books by Ornish and Esselstyn will give you what you need and are must-read:

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Best_Health_Books.aspx
http://www.peaktestosterone.com/statins.aspx

Now I will say that for some men, depending on how you eat, you might get a slight lowering of testosterone on a Low Fat Diet.  That's not a given though.  One study showed that testosterone held constant and estrogen dropped like a rock, which is exactly what you want.  See #2:

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Testosterone_Estrogen_Ratio.aspx

Now Bubba will tell you that cholesterol is health and the more the merrier.  So I'm not trying to be obnoxious here.  But you indicated that you were in my camp and felt that you wanted to control cholesterol, so that is why I am giving you all this information.

Gotta run...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: bubba29 on September 27, 2012, 06:00:38 pm
I already stopped Crestor but when I do my next blood work for T and everything else next month, my future of cholesterol medications rest on that. I want to be sure that if I workout, eat right and do everything MOSTLY right, not take Crestor, then I should have the best cholesterol result without medication. If it comes back high, then I will have no choice except for getting back on it. High cholesterol runs high in my family. I tried this in the past and the end result without meds was high cholesterol. I have high hopes but at the same time realistic due to past experience. The anti-depresents are a must right now, however, I heard Wellbutrin  might be more at an advantage. Please tell me your thoughts.

Does your family have a history of heart attacks?  How about diabetes?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 28, 2012, 02:55:40 pm
No heart attacks or diabetes but high cholesterol. Triglycerides are good but HDL and LDL are off the charts. Don't remember the numbers exactly. My family for the most part is healthy and exercises. I will push for low fat diet. I have to admit, I do love some brews time to time. I will do all I can before next blood work to see how big of a difference in one month of not taking crestor will have on me.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 28, 2012, 03:16:11 pm
I have to admit, I do love some brews time to time.

This has little to do with a Low Fat Diet as beer has no fat in it.  One beer per night is a mixed bag as far as health benefits.  You get a boost in cardiovascular protection; you get a slight increase in GI cancer risk; you get a slight boost in vasodilation; you get a slight decrease in testosterone; you get a slight increase in estrogen; etc.  Also, for some men it helps them fall asleep but then stimulates the brain later in the evening and can make for more restless sleep.

I have one a few times per week but just because I like it.  I'm not really counting on it to improve my cardiovascular risk.  German beer, French wine and some good coffee and tea - thank you Mother Nature!

Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 28, 2012, 03:59:43 pm
We all have guilty pleasures.

Peak. I gained 8 pounds of muscle in the last couple weeks. I did not do it purposely and even sit in the sauna and run more. It appears that since I stopped the Crestor, lifting heavier, and took T shots, I been packing on some good strong weight. You can see the six pack, however, I feel heavy.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Quincy on September 28, 2012, 05:30:36 pm
A11, I also started T about 3.5 weeks ago... T Cyp I believe. I was losing weight... about 2/3 lb per week for the last several weeks and then after taking the 1st injection I've have gained about 5 lbs. I think the TC also makes you retain more water. That is just too much weight to gain in 3 weeks. I've also noticed more strength like you have mentioned. Not sure how much of it is psychological, but it doesn't matter, I've gained more strength.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 28, 2012, 06:45:49 pm
We all have guilty pleasures.

Peak. I gained 8 pounds of muscle in the last couple weeks. I did not do it purposely and even sit in the sauna and run more. It appears that since I stopped the Crestor, lifting heavier, and took T shots, I been packing on some good strong weight. You can see the six pack, however, I feel heavy.

Nice!  Congrats on the muscle.  Question:  are you a long time lifter?  I'm asking for a reason.

Remember:  I can't advise you whether or not to go off of medication, so always talk to your doc first.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 28, 2012, 06:50:31 pm
That is just too much weight to gain in 3 weeks.

I agree with you overall but do want to point out that young guys can put on ungodly amounts of muscle when they first start lifting (assuming they lift hard and eat lots of protein of course).  It's downright scary at times.  It gets harder as time goes on...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Quincy on September 29, 2012, 07:50:03 am
That is just too much weight to gain in 3 weeks.

I agree with you overall but do want to point out that young guys can put on ungodly amounts of muscle when they first start lifting (assuming they lift hard and eat lots of protein of course).  It's downright scary at times.  It gets harder as time goes on...

I read on muscle boards guys doing TC often had more water gain vs using TE. I saw my weight go up about 5 lbs in 3 weeks and figured it was probably mostly water gain. I had missed about 4 weight workouts during this period; although I did a couple of gruesomely long mountain hike ascents and descents so my legs got quite a workout!
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 29, 2012, 07:55:00 am
I am a life time lifter. I been lifting on since I was 13. I probably had one year off in those 13 years. I have a stocky muscular build. I love the weights and releasing lots of stress by pumping iron. If there is much water retention, what do people do to minimize that?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 29, 2012, 07:57:44 am
Quincy, there is no psychological about how much strength I gained because doing bench press was a piece of cake when I did the weights from last week. There is and will be significant strength results so take advantage of the gym. I am...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Quincy on September 29, 2012, 09:26:03 am
yea, I plan on it. I'm just trying to figure it all out on the fly. It will be interesting to see our T blood levels after about a month on the TC. He wanted mine drawn before my next shot (unfortunately I'm on a 2 week cycle right now). In any event, that should be the lowest reading as a marker. I'm pretty sure I'm going to change to weekly in the near future as that doesn't overload your system upfront near as much.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on September 29, 2012, 10:26:53 am
If there is much water retention, what do people do to minimize that?

That's a good question.  I've never read anything on that, but I'm sure there something on the steroid boards.  I mean you could take some natural diuretics, such as black tea, but I'm not sure that would make much of a difference.

If I find out anything, I'll let you know.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on September 29, 2012, 02:09:48 pm
Thanks. The weekly shot has been working for me. I am eager to see my T scrore at the end of month.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on October 12, 2012, 11:34:34 am
Peak:

The results are in. I should let him post this but I really couldn't wait.

Testosterone level is 2412
Estradiol is 99 normal range  <=63
Cholesterol 236 normal range <200
Triglycerides 116 and the range < 150
HDL 33 range >39
Everything else in the blood work seems normal. What are your thoughts about the Testosterone being so high and the estradiol. I think the dose will have to lowered. He seems normal and less depressed.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on October 12, 2012, 02:07:36 pm
Hello all. Results are in as my wife stated. I went from 72 T score to 2412 T scores in a month. This is insane. I feel better than I ever been. Unfortunately, my cholesterol was high despite my intense working out without Crestor. I will start to take it again. The problem did not lie with Crestor, it was all testosterone. I feel better than I ever did in my life. Sad thing was my whole youth I had this problem. I am sure my dose will decrease for weekly T shots. My estradiol score of 99 PG/ML is too high. Does this mean I need to get on Nolvadex or another option?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Quincy on October 12, 2012, 03:08:25 pm
Wow! That is insanely high T. You were taking 200mg every 7 days right? When was the blood drawn? Was it the 6th day after the shot?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on October 12, 2012, 03:20:13 pm
I been taking 200mg every 7 days. I took it after 3 days after the shot. I moved to take the shot on Sundays because I am in the gym Monday thru Thursday at 5:15am. Blood was drawn this Wednesday. When after the most recent shot is the blood testosterone test at a highest point?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Quincy on October 12, 2012, 03:35:38 pm
I been taking 200mg every 7 days. I took it after 3 days after the shot. I moved to take the shot on Sundays because I am in the gym Monday thru Thursday at 5:15am. Blood was drawn this Wednesday. When after the most recent shot is the blood testosterone test at a highest point?

I'm not real sure about that. Maybe Peak will shed some light. I've read various sources that puts the half life of cypionate at 12 days. Theoretically you would think it is at its highest peak on the day of the injection and after 12 days it would be half as much.

I've also read the half life was 8 days from one of the pharmaceutical websites, so I'm still trying to figure it out. I've also read that it takes a day or two before it peaks out in your system. I would like to understand this better also because it is very useful in trying to dial in the dosage amount.

In any event, I am pretty sure you have too large a dose even if you did the test on the 7th day before your next shot. Even if it was half as much as the 2412 reading. I can't see how that high of a level didn't run your estradiol level up high also. So if you get your T level back to a healthy normal range, there is a good chance your estradiol level may self correct also. 
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on October 12, 2012, 03:48:56 pm
Estradiol is 99 and the normal range  <=63. Mine is high but is that not too bad considering the testosterone cypionate is being taken? I have a doctor appointment on the 23rd. Do I bring this up or not? I want some artillery before I go there. Bottom line is I feel better than I ever been. I will be happy if I can just regularly have a 100mg weekly injection. I proved in the last year with Androgel the devastating results of a 72 score which I am not willing to go back to after the year of hell I been through. My brain is the only thing lacking. I do not have mental fog as much but I do not feel focused. I feel strong, motivated and happy. The depression medicine is controlling my anger very well. I do not get mad often....For the most part, I am very happy with my life.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on October 12, 2012, 07:02:24 pm
Imo that's way too high and the E2 further proves it.  You're at steroid levels and in the high range even for those guys.  But did you get tested at the beginning of the cycle?

Out of curiosty, what did your doc say?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on October 12, 2012, 10:51:42 pm
I got tested 4 weekly shots later of 200mg. I see doc on the 23rd of this month to discuss. I got the results of the blood work by going over there and requested a copy. After my dose lowers, what do I do regarding estradiol score? I feel great right now. I can't remember the last time.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on October 12, 2012, 10:56:49 pm
I remember after my first month of taking Androgel, I went from 230 to 730. After another month it came right back down even lower. Is Nolvadex expensive with insurance? Peak, would this be an option for me? What do I need to worry about? I feel great. If I lowered dose and took something to lower estrogen, then I should be on the correct path....Right?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on October 13, 2012, 01:14:42 am
Clomid gets almost all the press but Nolvadex does very well as well.  This, I have always thought, is probably the best article that compares the two:

http://www.steroidology.com/forum/anabolic-steroid-forum/596847-nolva-vs-clomid-good-read.html

Prices, I believe, are pretty similar.

And it doesn't always work as anticipated for everyone:

http://peaktestosterone.com/forum/index.php?topic=307.msg2734#msg2734

One other note:

FightLowT hated Clomid although other guys have used it just fine:

http://peaktestosterone.com/forum/index.php?topic=223.msg1769#msg1769

Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Blade78 on October 13, 2012, 07:11:30 am
Can anyone explain from going from a 72 to over 4400 T score in one month?
drugs are wonderful things
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Quincy on October 13, 2012, 11:01:06 am
Testosterone level is 2412
Estradiol is 99 normal range  <=63
Cholesterol 236 normal range <200
Triglycerides 116 and the range < 150
HDL 33 range >39
Everything else in the blood work seems normal. What are your thoughts about the Testosterone being so high and the estradiol. I think the dose will have to lowered.

Most definitely it should be lowered. The good side of these results is your doctor actually tested your Estradiol. It seems too many doctors are unaware this is an important marker and you don't want it out of balance. You didn't happen to have a baseline estradiol level before the T treatment?

Also the lab report range shows <=63 as within range. There are other studies out that say it should be under 40... or lower.

One concern I have about your doctor is he didn't call you and tell you the results before your next appt 2 weeks out. If I was a doc, I would have called you and told you to go ahead and reduce your next shot to a lower level now.

Personally I would probably call the doctor now and ask if he wants you to start trying a lower dosage now since the results look WAY too high.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on October 13, 2012, 01:27:03 pm
I actually requested to do the estrogen tests, but I never knew before today what it ever was. I still have one 200mg shot left, however, I will break it up into two 100mg week doses. Life is great now....Thank God for this doctor to give me the jump start I needed....
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on October 13, 2012, 07:00:59 pm
Yes, but I find it very strange that your doctor is not concerned about these testosterone levels.  Something doesn't add up...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on October 13, 2012, 08:57:32 pm
Everybody is a critic in today's day in age. What does not add up is the idiot doctor who let my T score go to 72 and let me feel like dirt. People want to judge everybody else but I commend this doc.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on October 13, 2012, 11:29:51 pm
Everybody is a critic in today's day in age. What does not add up is the idiot doctor who let my T score go to 72 and let me feel like dirt. People want to judge everybody else but I commend this doc.

Yeah, sorry I went back to that point:  you've been clear about what you were thinking.  Still just scratching my head...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on October 14, 2012, 06:33:26 am
I agree this doctor should of called me telling me I should lower the dose immediately. I feel fine and do not feel my T score is 2400. I "feel" my score is around 1100.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on October 14, 2012, 06:46:13 am
I agree this doctor should of called me telling me I should lower the dose immediately. I feel fine and do not feel my T score is 2400. I "feel" my score is around 1100.

Well, the good news is that you find a, perhaps the root cause finally.  And, yes, I agree with you that not diagnosing low testosterone when a man is suffering so much is terrible.  Docs seem to be very callous at times to how this affects our careers, relationships and general health. 
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on October 14, 2012, 07:01:13 am
Now is the time where I find a good dose which makes me feel great and keeps my T score high. My doc is pretty flexible so I can make the decision between Clomid and Nolvadex. I am going to choose Clomid due to the attention it's getting so I can make a sound judgment on it. The dosage of Clomid I am not familiar with. Once I get these doses in line with good results in blood work, I will finally get off the anti-depressants.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on October 14, 2012, 07:25:24 am
Gotcha.  Well, let us know how it goes...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on October 14, 2012, 04:20:57 pm
I get the best erections I ever had in my life right now along with the best sex...As you said Peak, the root cause is discovered....Now getting it all under control is the issue.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on October 23, 2012, 03:08:00 pm
I had my follow up appointment with my doctor today. My testosterone cypionate dose was lowered to 100mg weekly. As for the high estrogen, I asked her to give me Nolvadex or Clomid. Unfortunately, she never wrote a prescription for a man for that stuff. She works in internal medicine and does not specialize with that stuff. She was open to the idea and told me to follow up with blood work in 1 month on the 100mg T shot. She also asked me to bring some medical research to see information on it though she will do her own research. I still feel great....Hope to see my estrogen readings lower naturally from the lower T does but who knows. Does anyone have information on Clomid and Nolvadex in credible article. Perhaps a medical journal or credible reference medical wise?

Still feeling good. Still working out at 0515 4 times a week. Strength is through the roof. Feeling good...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on October 23, 2012, 06:08:15 pm
Clomid is really a little different animal.

My question is why isn't Arimidex under consideration?  Nolvadex is good for certain kinds of gynocomastia but is known for causing libido issues.

There are studies here and some of the guys have mentioned their Clomid/Arimidex dosages on this board.  Just use the search above and it should work.

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/testosterone_arimidex.aspx
http://www.peaktestosterone.com/clomid_testosterone.aspx
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on November 08, 2012, 05:24:42 pm
Hello all. Its been awhile since my last post. Next doctor appt is 20 Nov. I still am hitting the gym in the mornings 4 times a week. I do cardio and hits the weights. I am strong and the fog in my head is a lot better. I have been reduced to 1cc of testosterone cypionate a week which is good because my last reading was too high. I do feel the libido going back to when I was when I started which is terrible. My estrodiol was high last test at 99. I will request Armidex when I go to the doctor. I will bring some findings of my research to my doc. Sucks because the first 2 weeks after my first testosterone injection was great. Unfortunately, the libido went down hills. No nocturnal erections or morning wood. Right when I thought I found what I needed, I got pulled back down. I am still trying hard exercising, eating a lot more healthy. No microwavable meals and not much junk. More vegis and fruits. At this point, I did everything I could to bring myself up to speed. The only thing now that I narrowed the problem down to is high estrogen...Will a medicine that reduces my estrodiol to a good score fix my libido?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: feelgood on November 08, 2012, 05:54:18 pm
you're halfway there - you at least know what *likely* is the issue. I'll let others with more knowledge chime in, but i have read SO MANY times that guys, even on HRT, only get the libido in a good place once they dial in the estradiol to a good level. And that level can be pretty different in a lot of guys, but it's probably safe to say that 99 is WAY high!

Definitely try the Arimidex - will be curious to hear.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on November 08, 2012, 06:22:39 pm
The only thing now that I narrowed the problem down to is high estrogen...Will a medicine that reduces my estrodiol to a good score fix my libido?

Yes, estrogen can be every bit as much of a culprit as testosterone and yours was very high.  Don't panic yet until you get tha tunder control
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on November 14, 2012, 04:06:23 pm
Hello all. I just did my lab work on Monday morning and I called to get some of the results over the phone. For the record, I took my last shot 1 week before the blood work. Here are the three numbers I received on the phone. I will get a copy of all the numbers next week with my follow up appointment:

HDL Cholesterol: 35 (It should be higher than 39)
Total Testosterone: 795
Estrodiol: 57

The really great news is when I started back on Crestor 10 mg a week, I am practically in the normal range. My only concern is I am unsure if my doctor will prescribe me the Armidex since my estrodiol to some appear in normal now. I do know that the first couple days after my T shot, I am sure my E2 is much higher.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on November 14, 2012, 09:15:36 pm

Total Testosterone: 795
Estrodiol: 57


This is not concerned a good ratio.  You need to ask your doctor about this one.  This will cause some guys some problems and much research shows that these levels of estradiol may cause men problems.  Have you seen the LEF link?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on November 28, 2012, 04:48:39 pm
Hello all. I finally had my follow up appointment with doc going over my lab work results. All my results related to my cholesterol, vitamin D, testosterone 795 except for my estrodiol 57. I brought in a bunch of medical evidence on Armidex and the benefits it has on men with high levels of estrodiol.

The good news today is she wrote me a prescription for 1mg Armidex with 3 refills. My plan from reading all you all write with the various forums and research provided on the forums is as follows:

Will take 1 mg dose daily for one week. Will take .5 mg dose daily on the second week. On the third week and so on I will take .5 mg EOD. If I feel better taking it everyday then I will continue that way because luckily my supply will be great since the script with 3 refills is for 10mg.

I will continue to take testosterone cypionate 1ml a week. I am still in the gym 4 days a week running and weight training. I am feeling better in the bedroom when I have a jump start but I am hoping my libido gets better with this armidex.


Does anyone know how long it will take for me to feel a difference from Armidex? Like I said before I am currently at 57 and that is a blood work taken after 7 days from taking the shot.

Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on November 28, 2012, 09:56:48 pm
You're getting closer I think. 

You'll probably feel the difference pretty quickly.  I base that on a few forum commentaries and what I've read on the steroid boards. 

A quick comment:

Most guys have been taking less than 1 mg/day.  For example, 399 was .5 mg EOD

http://peaktestosterone.com/forum/index.php?topic=738.msg6674#msg6674

and JackAndy .25 mg EOD.

http://peaktestosterone.com/forum/index.php?topic=699.msg6394#msg6394

Of course that's very individual and I'm sure your doc has done some hwk.  But I'm just saying watch how you feel and get tested soon again (if at all possible).
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: bubba29 on November 29, 2012, 08:40:05 am
Hello all. I just did my lab work on Monday morning and I called to get some of the results over the phone. For the record, I took my last shot 1 week before the blood work. Here are the three numbers I received on the phone. I will get a copy of all the numbers next week with my follow up appointment:

HDL Cholesterol: 35 (It should be higher than 39)
Total Testosterone: 795
Estrodiol: 57

The really great news is when I started back on Crestor 10 mg a week, I am practically in the normal range. My only concern is I am unsure if my doctor will prescribe me the Armidex since my estrodiol to some appear in normal now. I do know that the first couple days after my T shot, I am sure my E2 is much higher.

careful because crestor, a statin drug, is significantly associated with erectile dysfunction and low testosterone. 

http://healthydietsandscience.blogspot.com/search/label/Statins%20and%20Erectile%20Dysfunction (http://healthydietsandscience.blogspot.com/search/label/Statins%20and%20Erectile%20Dysfunction)
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on November 29, 2012, 08:59:02 am

careful because crestor, a statin drug, is significantly associated with erectile dysfunction and low testosterone. 

http://healthydietsandscience.blogspot.com/search/label/Statins%20and%20Erectile%20Dysfunction (http://healthydietsandscience.blogspot.com/search/label/Statins%20and%20Erectile%20Dysfunction)

Good catch.  Statins are associated with a host of problems, including one I just found out about:  increasing arachidonic acid.  These are very powerful with poorly understood effects:

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/statins.aspx
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: bubba29 on November 29, 2012, 10:01:28 am

careful because crestor, a statin drug, is significantly associated with erectile dysfunction and low testosterone. 

http://healthydietsandscience.blogspot.com/search/label/Statins%20and%20Erectile%20Dysfunction (http://healthydietsandscience.blogspot.com/search/label/Statins%20and%20Erectile%20Dysfunction)

Good catch.  Statins are associated with a host of problems, including one I just found out about:  increasing arachidonic acid.  These are very powerful with poorly understood effects:

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/statins.aspx

statins are the biggest scam i can think of.  it prevents very little in regard to cardiovascular events while also causing many negative side effects.  the drug companies have fleeced patients, governments, and insurers for billions every year.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on November 29, 2012, 03:58:33 pm
Thanks for the info gentlemen. As for the crestor, I am on a very low dose of 10mg a day. I have tried without it and worked out 4-5 times a week with a great diet and it raised dramatically again. I have said this before, it is hereditary and runs in my family for generations. I have experimented with taking it for years with and without diets and with and without working out. Bottom line is when I take it, my cholesterol is in normal range. I have taken 1mg today and 1mg yesterday. I feel better. Last night, I functioned great in the bedroom. I will be in the gym working out tomorrow morning at 0515 to run and weight train. I can tell you this, ever since working out 4 times a week in the mornings, I been feeling GREAT. Armidex is the last piece of the puzzle of perfecting my blood work. I feel great on day two. No problems. I do not know if I will have any dramatic feelings that differ than how I was without it. Life is good. I came a very long way since I was months ago.


I remember reading the beginning of this forum and all your comments to go with it feeling like dirt and scum of the earth. It pushed me into having the desire, courage and motivation to do everything I can to get myself together. Please provide any advice/recommendations to things I say. I will never know I am out of line or incorrect unless you all tell me. Thanks Peak for the advice in looking into the Armidex. I would not even of considered it if I never was on this forum.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on November 29, 2012, 05:31:20 pm
Thanks for the info gentlemen. As for the crestor, I am on a very low dose of 10mg a day. I have tried without it and worked out 4-5 times a week with a great diet and it raised dramatically again. I have said this before, it is hereditary and runs in my family for generations. I have experimented with taking it for years with and without diets and with and without working out. Bottom line is when I take it, my cholesterol is in normal range. I have taken 1mg today and 1mg yesterday. I feel better. Last night, I functioned great in the bedroom. I will be in the gym working out tomorrow morning at 0515 to run and weight train. I can tell you this, ever since working out 4 times a week in the mornings, I been feeling GREAT. Armidex is the last piece of the puzzle of perfecting my blood work. I feel great on day two. No problems. I do not know if I will have any dramatic feelings that differ than how I was without it. Life is good. I came a very long way since I was months ago.


I remember reading the beginning of this forum and all your comments to go with it feeling like dirt and scum of the earth. It pushed me into having the desire, courage and motivation to do everything I can to get myself together. Please provide any advice/recommendations to things I say. I will never know I am out of line or incorrect unless you all tell me. Thanks Peak for the advice in looking into the Armidex. I would not even of considered it if I never was on this forum.

Glad to hear you're doing better.  It's nice to have a break and feel normal again, eh?  Been there!

Keep up the good work!
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on December 02, 2012, 08:57:41 am
One last question. Why did my doctor say when taking Armidex, it is highly recommended I take Vitamin D-3? I been taking 6000 IU a day. Is it better to take it all at once or distributed in the day? Day or night?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on December 02, 2012, 10:03:23 am
One last question. Why did my doctor say when taking Armidex, it is highly recommended I take Vitamin D-3? I been taking 6000 IU a day. Is it better to take it all at once or distributed in the day? Day or night?

I answered here:

http://peaktestosterone.com/forum/index.php?topic=765.0
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on December 04, 2012, 06:30:55 pm
I been taking the Armidex 1mg a day over a week with high levels of vitamin D-3 and calcium along with the T shots 1cc weekly. One word to summarize how I fee not is INCREDIBLE. I know I need to slow the Armidex to .5 mg daily but do not know when I should make this move. Things are good. Workouts are hard. My nipple pain is going away though I still have some lumps behind them. Overall I am happy. I will wait less than two months from now and do a follow up blood work. Life is good...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on December 04, 2012, 06:51:03 pm
I been taking the Armidex 1mg a day over a week with high levels of vitamin D-3 and calcium along with the T shots 1cc weekly. One word to summarize how I fee not is INCREDIBLE. I know I need to slow the Armidex to .5 mg daily but do not know when I should make this move. Things are good. Workouts are hard. My nipple pain is going away though I still have some lumps behind them. Overall I am happy. I will wait less than two months from now and do a follow up blood work. Life is good...

Yeah, and from what I hear on the streets, you may be able to back off the Arimidex (if you are thin) completely in about six months.  You're body kind of stabilizes to a better point often.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on December 05, 2012, 03:26:33 pm
Thanks Peak. I would love to quit Armidex after 6 months and have my body stabilized. I do not feel any joint pain at this point with the 1mg daily but from I read from all the different forums my feeling great sometimes is only a month and going backwards. I do not want that. I will continue to work out, take 1 cc weekly injections, take vitamin D, calcium and do what I need to do. Is there any immediate indication when I need a less dose of Armidex? I want to do everything i need to do in order to keep what I have going with little to no interference. I know working out with weights and running does miracles alone.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on December 05, 2012, 05:37:54 pm
Thanks Peak. I would love to quit Armidex after 6 months and have my body stabilized. I do not feel any joint pain at this point with the 1mg daily but from I read from all the different forums my feeling great sometimes is only a month and going backwards. I do not want that. I will continue to work out, take 1 cc weekly injections, take vitamin D, calcium and do what I need to do. Is there any immediate indication when I need a less dose of Armidex? I want to do everything i need to do in order to keep what I have going with little to no interference. I know working out with weights and running does miracles alone.

1 mg daily?  Wow!  That's pretty beefy.  That will just about shut everything off in some guys.  Anyway, if you're estrogen starts going low, you may start to experience mind/psychological issues and/or joint pain.  But it's not always symptomatic, so it's much more important to just monitor regularly.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on December 05, 2012, 07:32:59 pm
Roger that. Keep in mind the 1 mg dose is only  a week so far...2 months ago my estrodiol rates was 98 and 2 weeks ago was 58. I am certain with the pain and lumps behind my nipples especially taking the T shots was necessary to take 1 mg dose. I am just trying to get on track for sustainment. I will go to .5 mg in the next couple days. If I do not feel joint pain or side effects by now, I did well and nows its time for reduction to .5 mg daily.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on December 05, 2012, 09:42:30 pm
Makes sense.  I think that's pretty common with knowledgeable docs but never heard of that big of a short term dose.  But it makes sense...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on December 18, 2012, 06:39:21 pm
Hello everyone. Been taking weekly 1ml shots of T CYP. First week of Armidex I took 1 mg daily for 7 days. Second week took .5mg Armidex, and now I am on EOD of .5 Armidex. My method has worked great. I am losing more of my water weight and limming down 5-7 pounds. Been lifting 4 times a week for the last 2-3 months straight. I love running and pumping iron in the mornings. My mojo is working well. I initiate my wife to mess around. I feel a lot better. I do not feel the pain behind my nipples anymore. I feel better with the T shots due to NO MORE CONVERSION TO ESTRODIOL. Life is good. I feel more of a man than I ever have. I would love people to read this entire forum to se the obstacles my wife and myself made to get me to this point today. THANK YOU ALL FOR EVERYTHING!!!!!!!!!!!@
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on December 18, 2012, 08:34:09 pm
Hello everyone. Been taking weekly 1ml shots of T CYP. First week of Armidex I took 1 mg daily for 7 days. Second week took .5mg Armidex, and now I am on EOD of .5 Armidex. My method has worked great. I am losing more of my water weight and limming down 5-7 pounds. Been lifting 4 times a week for the last 2-3 months straight. I love running and pumping iron in the mornings. My mojo is working well. I initiate my wife to mess around. I feel a lot better. I do not feel the pain behind my nipples anymore. I feel better with the T shots due to NO MORE CONVERSION TO ESTRODIOL. Life is good. I feel more of a man than I ever have. I would love people to read this entire forum to se the obstacles my wife and myself made to get me to this point today. THANK YOU ALL FOR EVERYTHING!!!!!!!!!!!@

Seriously glad to hear it.  It's amazing what a difference T and E2 make, eh?  I hope everything goes well for you guys.  Stay in touch...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on December 19, 2012, 04:39:39 pm
It is amazing. Though I am taking shots and meds, I tried all other options and this was the combo I been waiting for. I even lost 6 pounds in the last 2 weeks. Once in a while, I take 500mg L-Carnitine an hour before my workout and I sweat my butt off. I been working out super hard this week because I might indulge in more than average good eating the next week and a half off. Life is good.

For everybody that has been watching this forum, my best advice besides treatment is working out. Not just going to the gym but building up your intensity week by week. If your intensity raises, then progress will be made always. Also, switch workouts time to time. Need to shock the muscles because they get used to the same routine. For example, last week I lift heave pyramid sets increasing weights and decreasing reps with a steady one mile warm up run. This week I do a fast quarter mile then go to 4 different exercises immediately circuit training 2 muscle groups. I repeat and do another quarter mile and go immediately to 4 different sets of exercises 2 muscle groups. The point is to change what you do.

Medicine will do wonders like T shots and armidex for me but it does not end there. Do not watch porno and masturbate repetitively. You will kill your libido until its gone. Stop that, work out, and join back the real world.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on December 19, 2012, 06:40:59 pm
Good advice.  (Make sure you are not overtraining of course.  You don't want to undo all your hard work.)
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on January 08, 2013, 04:00:32 pm
Hello Peak and everybody. I want to give you an update of my progress of my treatment. I am still taking my 1cc of 200 ml of Testosterone Cypionate a week and .5mg-1mg daily dose of Armidex. My next follow up blood work is in February. Words cannot describe how I been but in one word it will have to be INCREDIBLE. I make love to my wife on an average 6-8 times a week. I am taking advantage of this feeling because I never had it before and I am 34 years old. I love it. I am finally at the point where my wife has had enough in the bedroom and I am asking for more. This is the first in my life I ever felt so good and confident. I am still working out 4 days a week in the mornings at 0515 running and lifting. I do not overtrain though. I lift one muscle group a week by splitting up my muscles in the 4 days a week. Monday will be chest, tuesday arms etc... 1 mile run 4 days a week for warm up. I feel better at work and no more have the heavy cloudy feeling in my head. Peak, I owe you a big thank you with the Armidex consideration you told me about. Since I started that after I been on the T injections for a month, life has changed since I knew it. Life is good. My whole life I was in the gutter and felt I was never evert to be normal but I stand corrected.

To all those reading with problems like mine, have hope and pursue treatment from a well qualified doctor. I feel reborn and a brand new person. Thank you peak for helping my wife understand these issues from the beginning. Though you told her at first to leave me because it sounded like I didn't care, my wife told me about all the things wrong with me that I never knew about. Once I finally realized and tried to improve myself and seek medical help and made it through the aweful Androgel which did absolutely nothing to me, I got the correct treatment of T injections and Armidex. Now after a long road to get here, I made it to be treated perfectly. Thanks again for all your knowledge.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on January 08, 2013, 08:40:06 pm
Your story is one of the most incredible on here.  And what is interesting about it is that it emphasizes something that no one can understand until they've gone through it:  the misery of being low testosterone.  It is truly miserable and life changing.  I've always said it turns you into a functioning zombie. 

By the way, you wrote that I advised your wife to leave you.  Now I would be absolutely shocked if I said anything like that.  Maybe I had a brain outage, but here is what I remember:  you absolutely did not want to change - at one point of course - and did not want to go in for help.  That's what I was hearing.  So I told your wife to take care of herself.  Essentially I was telling her to get ready for a rocky ride.  We've all had a loved one who was sick and just would not take care of themselves.  What very often happens is that they drag the health down of everyone around them and that's not a good thing of course.

Now that leads to my question:  what made you finally want to change?  What finally got you into the door of the doc? 

I'm asking that, because, to be honest, I'm one of the those annoying overachieving self-improvement kind of guys.  I want to always make myself bigger, faster, better, stronger, etc.  But I find so many men just give up.  If you can give a little insight here, it might really help me when I run across that situation in the future. 

Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Blade78 on January 08, 2013, 08:55:32 pm

Now that leads to my question:  what made you finally want to change?  What finally got you into the door of the doc? 

I wonder also....
I'm asking that, because, to be honest, I'm one of the those annoying overachieving self-improvement kind of guys.  I want to always make myself bigger, faster, better, stronger, etc.  But I find so many men just give up.   
do you watch Breaking Bad?  in one episode, one character, (jane) was sleeping and she vommited and because she had been high, she didnt wake up, so he died
she was well aware that could happen, yet she still got high and took that risk
I dont understand why people get high.  I dont undertand most of what people do..well maybe, everyone wants instant gratification...
everything you talk about, Peak, takes time and effort.......what are your weaknesses?

Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on January 08, 2013, 09:21:58 pm

everything you talk about, Peak, takes time and effort.......

Well, that's one way to look at it.  Now there are people in my family who would call it self-centered self preoccupation.  In spite of it, they put up with me...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Blade78 on January 08, 2013, 10:55:17 pm

everything you talk about, Peak, takes time and effort.......

Well, that's one way to look at it.  Now there are people in my family who would call it self-centered self preoccupation.  In spite of it, they put up with me...
self-centered?  because what you talk about only affect you?  dont they know they can also implent what you do?  you seem to be a great source of information

I tried to read wheat belly and it was too indepth for me, if you were in my family, Id ask you about it and ask you you opinion about my parents low cal bread vs my 100% sprouted bread...
http://www.foodforlife.com/product/breads/ezekiel-49-cinnamon-raisin-whole-grain-bread
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on January 09, 2013, 05:36:34 am
If they are feeling good, it's probably okay.  Dr. Davis makes the argument, thought, that wheat is probably causing a lot of underlying immune responses that we don't understand yet because it is so heavily GMO'd.  That hasn't been proven yet of course, but in his practice he has noticed many people have a big improvement in health, mental and physical when they get off wheat.  So imo the best thing to do is lay off the wheat, whole or otherwise, and see if you feel better.

Another thing about wheat:  it can spike blood sugar and insulin pretty good.  I didn't read the ingrediennts, but if it's mostly whole wheat, it's glycemic index will be pretty high, so you don't want to eat too much.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Blade78 on January 09, 2013, 11:32:37 am
If they are feeling good, it's probably okay.  Dr. Davis makes the argument, thought, that wheat is probably causing a lot of underlying immune responses that we don't understand yet because it is so heavily GMO'd.  That hasn't been proven yet of course, but in his practice he has noticed many people have a big improvement in health, mental and physical when they get off wheat.  So imo the best thing to do is lay off the wheat, whole or otherwise, and see if you feel better.

Another thing about wheat:  it can spike blood sugar and insulin pretty good.  I didn't read the ingrediennts, but if it's mostly whole wheat, it's glycemic index will be pretty high, so you don't want to eat too much.
yes, thats the main question I wondered about:
spiking of the blood sugar
in my bread vs my parents bread
mine has the ingredients
Organic Sprouted Wheat, Filtered Water, Organic Raisins, Organic Sprouted Barley, Organic Sprouted Millet, Organic Malted Barley, Organic Sprouted Lentils, Organic Sprouted Soybeans, Organic Sprouted Spelt, Fresh Yeast, Organic Wheat Gluten, Sea Salt, Organic Cinnamon.

and theirs is whole wheat as the 1st ingredient

any thoughts?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on January 09, 2013, 01:57:07 pm

yes, thats the main question I wondered about:
spiking of the blood sugar
in my bread vs my parents bread
mine has the ingredients
Organic Sprouted Wheat, Filtered Water, Organic Raisins, Organic Sprouted Barley, Organic Sprouted Millet, Organic Malted Barley, Organic Sprouted Lentils, Organic Sprouted Soybeans, Organic Sprouted Spelt, Fresh Yeast, Organic Wheat Gluten, Sea Salt, Organic Cinnamon.

and theirs is whole wheat as the 1st ingredient

any thoughts?

Well being a health geek, I would measure my blood sugar post-meal after eating wheat to see exactly what it is doing to me.  It'll just a few bucks for the lances and it will pay big dividends potentially.

Now as far as wheat being healthy in general, you might want to read Bubba's post here:

http://escapetheherdblog.blogspot.com/2010/11/roll-of-nickels-experiment.html

Pretty interesting stuff.  (He posted this on the other thread.)
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on January 11, 2013, 09:09:16 pm
 Peak, to answer your questions "what made you finally want to change?" and "What finally got you into the door of the doc?". I was tired of being miserable. I was at the point that I describe as "rock bottom". I had a heavy fog in my head, I was sick of life, I never looked forward to anything and felt like I was worthless. My wife was the key player in me seeking a doctors help. As you know, she was contacting you and gathering information on your website from you and other knowledgable people on the subject. My wife essentially did all my homework. She arranged doctor visits, blood work, and  told me about the various prescriptions out there that she learned about. I was so sick of being miserable that I followed my wife's advice. I thank you Peak to give my wife the tools she needed to set me up for success on my journey to get well. It was not easy. I tried different medicines that did not work and went through trial and error. I finally found what worked for me. My wife is the one who got me into the door at the doctor. After I pursued help, then I took my own initiative with going to the gym. I did not want to only rely on medicine. I wanted to rely on improving my well being by watching what I eat on improving my personnel fitness goals.

I will tell you this Peak, the day my wife told me that you said that she needs to take care of herself and it sounded like I did not want to change is the day that stuck an imprint in my brain. The imprint said that my life is at "rock bottom". I need to make this happen now. I can't let this go any longer. How much worse and longer is this forum that she started going to get? I had enough of it. Thank God that everything went the way it did. If you never communicated with my wife and if my wife did not learn what a bad condition I was in, I might be brain dead today fired from my good job in a unstable mental condition.

Now that I feel the way I do, I feel reborn and value everyday and everything I do. I do not take anything for granted. After going through what I been through, I enjoy the time with my wife, time with my kids, and emotions I never had in my life. I cant believe my whole life was so miserable. In my case, life get better with age...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on January 11, 2013, 10:01:49 pm
Great story!  I am definitely going to file that one away and pass it on to guys showing up at the forum wondering if T and E2 can make a difference!

By the way, I can really relate so much to what you are saying.  Some day I'll relate a few things about that.

One last thing:

You keep and like your testosterone pretty high, so make sure you drop the body fat.  Get those abs back so your E2 is as low as naturally possible and you can push that Arimidex dosage down.  Imo you want to limit pharmaceutical usage as much as possible.  I don't think you've talked about being overweight, but get rid of all visceral fat.  Don't have any studies for this, but then the studies haven't really looked at 30 years of HRT at high levels with Arimidex usage.  You could argue that this could even be better, but I'd play it safe...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on January 13, 2013, 10:51:10 am
For the record, I am pretty low on body fat. Hadn't had a test but if I did I would estimate it around 8%. I have minimal body fat but it is there. I would guess that I naturally have higher E2 levels than normal. I will continue to knock down as much body fat as I can and work extra hard on the once in a while junk foods I should avoid. I do not expect to take the Armidex forever. I was hoping like you said back 6 months or so the Armidex will hopefuly naturally stabilize at a low level. Time will tell. Thanks again for the recommendations and feedback. I always listen, soak it in and take it for consideration.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on January 13, 2013, 01:19:12 pm
Noted.  Doesn't sound like you need to lose any weight!

And, yes, some guys are just high converters.  Don't have my arms yet around why yet.  Seems like it can't be all genetic...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on January 15, 2013, 04:21:41 pm
Peak, do you have any idea when I should choose to stop taking the anti-depressents? My doctor told me they feel I should continue taking it because it is not a very hight dose. What is your recommendation based on what you read in this forum?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on January 15, 2013, 08:34:34 pm
Peak, do you have any idea when I should choose to stop taking the anti-depressents? My doctor told me they feel I should continue taking it because it is not a very hight dose. What is your recommendation based on what you read in this forum?

I'm sorry, but I can't really tell you when to get off/on a pharmaceutical.  If you want to try to do it under your doc's supervision of course, I think the best way is always to slowly cut back on the dose.  Eventually you get to a point where the dose is so small that you realize that it couldn't possibly be doing anything.  But the good thing also about doing this, is that if you start to notice that you don't feel good any more after backing down on the dose a little, you can ramp it back up.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on January 16, 2013, 05:19:36 am
True, good point.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on January 20, 2013, 11:17:18 pm
Another update: I still am feeling AWESOME. I am doing great. I read a couple other forums when I found some spare time with some people taking Armidex on lower doses. I am not a doctor and can't speak for other as I may be a very higher estrogen converter but Armidex at every other day at .5 or .75 made me feel like I was not at my potential. Also, my nipples got sore waiting every other day. For myself, I need .5 to 1 mg daily. I know about bone loss and the effect of too low of estrogen also messing with ED, but on my dose I never felt any bad effect of negative side effects. I am really interested to see what my E2 reading is in February so I can actually respond to some of these forums with actual back-up evidence. If you are strictly talking about libido and ED and sense of well being, I am doing awesome from every aspect with my dosage. I welcome questions but like I said I will have support once I get my next follow up blood work, but sometimes the perfect scores in blood work does not mean you will feel like me. I go off of my libido, strength of erection and sense of well being. That is essentially the point of where we think of the reading should be. Thanks again peak for listening to myself, wife, and fellow people who have two sense to add or need advice.

This weekend I felt like I had to lift because I just took a T shot a day before and could not take a day time nap because I felt like I could not sit still. I went to the gym and ran a mile under 7 minutes, did hardcore ab workout with ab straps doing leg raises and knee raises, and lifted back intensely. Afterwards, I felt a weight off of my impatient feeling like a drug almost. I felt incredible. I love the fact that workouts for me does lifting of my spirit and takes a lot of stress and weight off of me. I do not mean a foggy depressed weight in my head but more so an urge to use my testosterone as a man. I told my wife at that point I had to go to the gym, not to get mad at me, this was an urge that had to be fulfilled. She understood from what she said she has read with treatments. I came back home normal and balanced. It is so nice to have this feeling that I can utilize in such a great way and come home even better than woken up.

I will continue to post moments that will be useful to Peak and others to help people.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Blade78 on January 21, 2013, 05:47:16 am


I will continue to post moments that will be useful to Peak and others to help people.
Very much appreciate you letting us know what you are doing.
I have a friend who has had his Test checked as he cuts/gains and he found this Peak Testosterone was when he was at 11-13% bodyfat, I read you were at 8% and I dont know if that's natural for you or you dieted down to it and stay at it;  are you naturally at 8%?

so you are on Arimidex:\? Which is an aromatase inhibitor that does wonders your T/E ratio by binding to the aromatase enzyme that converts testosterone to estrogen.

WHat is your average Test level without drugs?


with drugs?
what is your T/E ratio?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on January 21, 2013, 06:52:06 am
I am estimated a 8% body fat at most but possibly less. I need to do another test. I barely can pinch much skin/fat on me. I am naturally stocky but I use that to my advantage in the gym. I would not say I am on a diet, but I would call it a lifestyle change more than anything else. I eat right and indulge once in a while with sweets if I deserve it. I cut drinking sodas to one to two a week at most.

It was originally under 300 without anything then I started Androgel. My average test level without T-Cyp injections was under 100 with Androgel after an entire year of use. I threw Androgel in the trash and highly recommend people do not buy into that expensive garbage that does not work.

When I first took my injections and was not prescribed Armidex, I started to get sore and lumpy nipples and ED. After the Armidex, miracles happened.

Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on January 21, 2013, 07:44:54 am
Another update: I still am feeling AWESOME. I am doing great. I read a couple other forums when I found some spare time with some people taking Armidex on lower doses. I am not a doctor and can't speak for other as I may be a very higher estrogen converter but Armidex at every other day at .5 or .75 made me feel like I was not at my potential. Also, my nipples got sore waiting every other day. For myself, I need .5 to 1 mg daily. I know about bone loss and the effect of too low of estrogen also messing with ED, but on my dose I never felt any bad effect of negative side effects. I am really interested to see what my E2 reading is in February so I can actually respond to some of these forums with actual back-up evidence. If you are strictly talking about libido and ED and sense of well being, I am doing awesome from every aspect with my dosage. I welcome questions but like I said I will have support once I get my next follow up blood work, but sometimes the perfect scores in blood work does not mean you will feel like me. I go off of my libido, strength of erection and sense of well being. That is essentially the point of where we think of the reading should be. Thanks again peak for listening to myself, wife, and fellow people who have two sense to add or need advice.

This weekend I felt like I had to lift because I just took a T shot a day before and could not take a day time nap because I felt like I could not sit still. I went to the gym and ran a mile under 7 minutes, did hardcore ab workout with ab straps doing leg raises and knee raises, and lifted back intensely. Afterwards, I felt a weight off of my impatient feeling like a drug almost. I felt incredible. I love the fact that workouts for me does lifting of my spirit and takes a lot of stress and weight off of me. I do not mean a foggy depressed weight in my head but more so an urge to use my testosterone as a man. I told my wife at that point I had to go to the gym, not to get mad at me, this was an urge that had to be fulfilled. She understood from what she said she has read with treatments. I came back home normal and balanced. It is so nice to have this feeling that I can utilize in such a great way and come home even better than woken up.

I will continue to post moments that will be useful to Peak and others to help people.

Testosterone is stimulating and difficult to describe just how.  It's kind of like "alertness" and a latent energy.  However, you can go too far and actually kind of "wire" yourself.  But it sounds like you're doing good and so congrats.  Just make sure you haven't gone too far...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on January 21, 2013, 06:55:37 pm
What is it to "wire" myself?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Blade78 on January 21, 2013, 07:59:25 pm
I am estimated a 8% body fat at most but possibly less. I need to do another test. I barely can pinch much skin/fat on me. I am naturally stocky but I use that to my advantage in the gym. I would not say I am on a diet, but I would call it a lifestyle change more than anything else. I eat right and indulge once in a while with sweets if I deserve it. I cut drinking sodas to one to two a week at most.

It was originally under 300 without anything then I started Androgel. My average test level without T-Cyp injections was under 100 with Androgel after an entire year of use. I threw Androgel in the trash and highly recommend people do not buy into that expensive garbage that does not work.

When I first took my injections and was not prescribed Armidex, I started to get sore and lumpy nipples and ED. After the Armidex, miracles happened.
thats not clear about whether you diet down from a higher bodyfat to 8% , it sounds lke you did. how long ago was that?
being sub 10% can cause hormones to plumment
I wonder what would happen to your test level/feelings if you took bromocriptine

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/bromocriptine

I gave you an tidpit from the book

Bromocriptine and sex
Ok, I bet that topic heading grabbed your attention, even if you’re wondering
what sex has to do with any of this. But let’s face it, most of us want to be more
muscular and/or leaner for the most superficial and shallow of reasons. Sure, we tell
people that it’s to be healthier or live a fuller life, or to fulfill some psychological void in
our life, and there may be a little truth to all of that. In the big scheme of things, it’s
pretty much bull. We mostly put ourselves through this to look better naked. Or to look
good enough to potential sexual partners so that we get more of an opportunity to
frolic naked with them.
In that vein, I should mention that bromocriptine may have pro-sexual effects on
top of everything else. Just as it is involved in so many other aspects of human
physiology, the dopaminergic (DA producing) system is involved in sexual response.
Dopamine appears to be involved in both sexual response and male erection,
although it’s role in female sexual response is less well established (82).
A known response to dieting is a decrease in both sexual interest and ability,
which makes a certain type of evolutionary sense. When you’re starving really isn’t a
great time to get your mate pregnant because there won’t be enough food available to
bring the baby to term. Dropping leptin, and its effects on DA (and subsequently other
hormones such as testosterone and estrogen, both of which are involved in sex drive)
might well be involved in this decrease in sexual function (it s already established that
dropping leptin shuts down normal female reproductive functioning). Bromocriptine,
by normalizing DA levels might be expected to have pro-sexual effects in this regard.
Additionally, a surge in prolactin following orgasm appears to be related to the
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on January 21, 2013, 08:32:37 pm
What is it to "wire" myself?

Okay, it doesn't sound like this is an issue.  But a quick couple of questions:  are you having trouble sleeping?  Are you losing your temper more easily?  Are you a little overly aggressive?

These kind of vague things, but it is possible to go too high.  You sound like you're doing great, but I just to make sure you've thought about the other side.

And the reason I asked is that you mentioned a kind of "restlessness" where you had to go work out.  I'm just checking.  It may be nothing - just asking...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Blade78 on January 21, 2013, 10:47:48 pm
What is it to "wire" myself?

Okay, it doesn't sound like this is an issue.  But a quick couple of questions:  are you having trouble sleeping?  Are you losing your temper more easily?  Are you a little overly aggressive?

These kind of vague things, but it is possible to go too high.  You sound like you're doing great, but I just to make sure you've thought about the other side.

And the reason I asked is that you mentioned a kind of "restlessness" where you had to go work out.  I'm just checking.  It may be nothing - just asking...
I cant tell what "wire  myself" means from this reply?
does "wire yourself" mean to give you lots of energy and increase sensitivity to things/people  IE lower ability for tolerance when things annoy you?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on January 22, 2013, 09:11:32 am
What is it to "wire" myself?

Okay, it doesn't sound like this is an issue.  But a quick couple of questions:  are you having trouble sleeping?  Are you losing your temper more easily?  Are you a little overly aggressive?

These kind of vague things, but it is possible to go too high.  You sound like you're doing great, but I just to make sure you've thought about the other side.

And the reason I asked is that you mentioned a kind of "restlessness" where you had to go work out.  I'm just checking.  It may be nothing - just asking...
I cant tell what "wire  myself" means from this reply?
does "wire yourself" mean to give you lots of energy and increase sensitivity to things/people  IE lower ability for tolerance when things annoy you?

Well, you know how difficult it is to describe psychological stuff.  The extreme case is "roid rage".  You're wired as in a wire ready to trip...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on January 22, 2013, 03:05:10 pm
I am not having any more trouble sleeping than I normally do. I wake up one time a night to take a piss but overall my sleep is good.

I am not losing my temper more easily.

I am not overly aggressive.

I have none of these "wire" descriptions.

The only restlessness I had was having the itch to work out.

I am unsure regarding my body fat history so I cannot provide a good answer. What I can tell you for sure is I was in good shape my whole life in low-normal range.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on January 22, 2013, 03:17:09 pm
I am not having any more trouble sleeping than I normally do. I wake up one time a night to take a piss but overall my sleep is good.

I am not losing my temper more easily.

I am not overly aggressive.

I have none of these "wire" descriptions.

The only restlessness I had was having the itch to work out.


Outstanding! 

And understood about the work out.  I get "cabin fever" sometimes myself and have to get to the gym.  (The rest of the family thinks I'm crazy...)

Btw, someone responded to you on the other thread I believe if you're int'd...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on January 22, 2013, 06:35:30 pm
Thanks for letting me know. I responded. I am eager to know my next lab results. My wife understood my urge to hit the gym. I joked with her and said I would rather hit the weights than take out the roid rage on her....We both had a laugh about that. We definitely utilize the benefits  together of my T boosts in the bedroom.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on January 22, 2013, 08:24:05 pm
Thanks for letting me know. I responded. I am eager to know my next lab results. My wife understood my urge to hit the gym. I joked with her and said I would rather hit the weights than take out the roid rage on her....We both had a laugh about that. We definitely utilize the benefits  together of my T boosts in the bedroom.

Well, you guys sound likek a new couple.   Nice...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on February 28, 2013, 03:44:08 pm
Hello All. After 4 months of T injections and 3 months of Armidex, here is the updated blood work results:

Blood pressure: 86/67 (much, much lower than 3 months ago, I think it is due to not being hydrated enough)

Cholesterol: 185
Triglycerides: 204
HDL: 37
LDL: 107
Risk Ratio LDL/HDL: 2.9

Testosterone: 764
Estrodiol: 15

Vitamin D: 55
Calcium: 25

CK: 752

I feel great. I am going to lower the dose of Armidex to .5 EOD. Armidex worked very well for me and lowered substantially the last 3 months. Now is time for sustainment. I need to drink more water more often.

Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Quincy on February 28, 2013, 04:11:25 pm
T numbers are looking good. Are you still taking 200mg/wk? Did you do the bloodwork at the end of the shot cycle?

I thought you were on some type of anti depressant... are you still taking that or did you drop it?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on February 28, 2013, 05:25:57 pm
I am taking 1mg/week for the last 2-3 months. Blood work came 4th day after shot. I am still taking 50 mg of the generic zoloft. Also take 10mg of crestor. Doctor recommend to stay on this low dose of zoloft.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on February 28, 2013, 05:46:22 pm
meant to say T shot of 100mg/weekly
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on February 28, 2013, 07:53:28 pm
Congrats on feeling good!

A few comments:

--Notice that your estradiol is now a little low.  Shouldn't you talk to your doc about when you're going to start backing off the Arimidex?

--Aren't you a little worried (long term) about the triglycerides.  Gotta watch those arteries, eh?

--You've got a combo of medium high cholesterol and triglycerides.  You'll want to read up on this as that can be a nasty combination.  I don't think all the testosterone in the world can protect you forever against that.  Just my two cents...

And hope you don't mind me saying that, but I really wish someone had told me back when I was in my 30's...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on February 28, 2013, 09:43:04 pm
Question 1. I been mostly on a 1mg every day on the armidex for the entire 3 months. Now that I did my own experimentation, I know to cut down to every other day. My goal was exceeded on this high dosage so I know exactly what I need to do to get it around 20-22. I am happy with the reading and in no way I am concerned based onthe dosage I been on. EASY MINOR CHANGE.

Question 2. I am not worried at all about the triglycerides. This is because I tool the blood work in the afternoon and ate a small lunch though I was supposed to be fasting. I was mainly concerned with the T and E2. Minor change and it is good once I do the blood work as told.

Question 3. I ate not too long before and the risk ratio LDL to HDL was within normal limits. I ate before and can promise you if I took the blood work in the morning it would've been very close to exact normal. Even the doc said I was only slightly off by some of those readings which was not off the charts, very minor. I can tell you if I did not eat like I was supposed to I would be right on. I don't want to hear I should not of done that, I know but the measures were so close to above limits, I consider it great.

I also forgot to tell you al since the last blood work I lost 13 pounds and body mass index decreased a great amount. The doc was very proud of me.

I feel amazing. I was stubborn with the eating before but knowing I was so close to within range with the eating, I am right on the money. I am loving life right now.

Still working out 3 times a week to 4 times. I do not go as hardcore as before but losing 13 pounds, I run better and have so many cuts. The doctor was like "WOW". My body looks like I am back in high school again.

I do not need the guidance with eating before blood work for cholesterol. I was still just some off and doc was proud when she saw me.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on February 28, 2013, 10:38:05 pm
Noted.  Okay, just checking on you for long term.  Again, congrats on the great news...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on February 28, 2013, 11:50:26 pm
Any additional questions I have not answered, hit me up. Duty calls now. Will check responses tomorrow.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Quincy on March 01, 2013, 12:38:43 pm
Sounds like you are doing really good. Some people are impacted by TRT moreso than others; in a positive way. Sounds like you are a 10 1/2 on a scale of 1 to 10. Congrats man!
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on March 01, 2013, 02:44:49 pm
Thanks. I do feel that way.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on March 01, 2013, 03:16:21 pm
Sounds like you are doing really good. Some people are impacted by TRT moreso than others; in a positive way. Sounds like you are a 10 1/2 on a scale of 1 to 10. Congrats man!

Great point Quincy.  A number of men have written in saying, "When will I feel anything?"
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on March 01, 2013, 09:16:43 pm
The sad part is that I went 10 or more years without the knowledge and treatment I got here and used to get the correct treatment at the doctor.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on March 01, 2013, 09:55:38 pm
The sad part is that I went 10 or more years without the knowledge and treatment I got here and used to get the correct treatment at the doctor.

Agreed.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on March 01, 2013, 11:54:56 pm
Based on all I said,what recommendations do you feel I need to follow or alerts to keep my eyes out for?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on March 02, 2013, 09:07:16 am
Based on all I said,what recommendations do you feel I need to follow or alerts to keep my eyes out for?

Hey, you're doing great, obviously, and are a poster child for HRT.  Seriously, enjoy these good times in life! 

I guess the only comment I have is the following, which hopefully won't be annoying:

Well, I would make sure you have inflammation under control and I would also try to manage the pain with more natural means. Pain is much more manageable than you might think, including everything from meditation to hypnotherapy. Yes, I know that is not always possible, but you want to make sure the lortab is used minimally.  I probably don't need to tell you that, but I'm just mentioning it because there are natural ways to handle pain (at least somewhat).

Hypnotherapy, and I mean the legitimate, non-fair grounds kind, can completely take away pain.  It's kind of freaky, but I've seen this with a relative with, of all things, dental work. 

Also, doesn't the hydrocodone usually come with ibuprofen or acetomeniphen?  These are big troublemakers as well:

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Tylenol_Dangers.aspx

And I'm sure you know this but it interacts with alcohol so you have to be really careful.



Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on March 02, 2013, 10:28:41 am
Thanks Peak. This is good to know and will keep the use minimal. I will continue to let you all know how I am doing. I finally feel like a normal guy. I will continue to work out 3-4 times a week, eat well, drink more water than I do now, get plenty of rest and stay positive. The mind does wonders to the body. Until the next time...Have a great Saturday. Just got done eating a nice breakfast and today is date night with the wife. Our kids went the grandma and grandpa. Let the games begin...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on March 02, 2013, 02:13:23 pm
Thanks Peak. This is good to know and will keep the use minimal. I will continue to let you all know how I am doing. I finally feel like a normal guy. I will continue to work out 3-4 times a week, eat well, drink more water than I do now, get plenty of rest and stay positive. The mind does wonders to the body. Until the next time...Have a great Saturday. Just got done eating a nice breakfast and today is date night with the wife. Our kids went the grandma and grandpa. Let the games begin...

Hey, you are doing the right thing by trying to get your health in order at a young age.  You are going to see friends and family lose their health and passion for life as they age at a rapid rate due to a Western lifestyle.  But try to be different and keep those arteries and neurons in good shape for decades to come...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on March 02, 2013, 02:29:09 pm
Thanks again Peak. I will not let the rest of my life feel like the last decade. I been reborn. I just got done shopping with my wife, letting her try on different outfits and enjoying it. She bought 3 pants and 2 dresses. Before I was miserable and depressed. Now I am loving to see her try on outfits and wear them for me. Life has changed so much. She will wear a new outfit for our date night tonight. Forget going out to movies where there is no socialization. I want the interaction. A couple margaritas will not hurt either. Tonight is seafood night and a couple cocktails followed by walks on the water.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on March 02, 2013, 03:14:00 pm
Thanks again Peak. I will not let the rest of my life feel like the last decade. I been reborn. I just got done shopping with my wife, letting her try on different outfits and enjoying it. She bought 3 pants and 2 dresses. Before I was miserable and depressed. Now I am loving to see her try on outfits and wear them for me. Life has changed so much. She will wear a new outfit for our date night tonight. Forget going out to movies where there is no socialization. I want the interaction. A couple margaritas will not hurt either. Tonight is seafood night and a couple cocktails followed by walks on the water.

Nice!  Well, I know your wife stuck by you through some rough years, right?  So I'm glad that things are going so well:  you guys are a great example of "for better or worse".  I don't mean anything by that, except that you guys have worked through everything and now are clearly enjoying the fruits of your labors.  Well deserved...

Margaritas.  Best mixed drink (when it's done right) if you ask me...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Blade78 on March 02, 2013, 07:11:51 pm
hey Peak
what's do you think are the best mixed drinks?
(assume it's done right)
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on March 03, 2013, 10:40:38 pm
Guys, date night was a 10 out of 10. We walked along the water, went to a great seafood restaurant. I had parmesan blackened snapper and she had a seafood platter. We both added an additional blackened shrimp skewer. We also had appetizers of crab cakes and spinach, artichoke and crap dip. We also finished with a desert of creme brulee. Yes the dinner was around 100 bucks, but it was worth it. We had ocean view and the service and food was to die for. The best fish I ever ate. I am avoiding MSG now everywhere.

http://www.truthinlabeling.org/hiddensources.html

Check out the above link(copy and paste it). There are so many ways brand names are tricking us with MSG. There are 20-30 names that are the same thing as MSG ,however, people only know one name MSG. I know all the tricks now and this link will show you that.


After dinner and walks on the water, we went to another couples house who we really like. I had a lot of drinks of whiskey and sprite. My wife had a vodka cranberry. She only had one because she was driving back. I am not going to lie to you all. I do indulge in adult cocktails here and there. I am responsible though with driving and weekdays of work. I enjoy a nice beer after work sometimes. Also, it gets the blood rushing in my wife sometimes so we can have a wild and crazy night together.

Things are great. please look at that MSG website so you can be schooled if you haven't already. Also, I will share something crazy we did since I am anonymous. We went to the mall in broad daylight. I parked at the very end of the parking lot. I was spontaneous and told my wife to go in the back seat and I had my way with her. I made it all about her though. As soon as she went, I stopped and we put our pants or shorts all. Then we went to the mall. Can you believe that? Good stuff....That was in the day today.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on March 03, 2013, 10:49:04 pm
Guys, date night was a 10 out of 10. We walked along the water, went to a great seafood restaurant. I had parmesan blackened snapper and she had a seafood platter. We both added an additional blackened shrimp skewer. We also had appetizers of crab cakes and spinach, artichoke and crap dip. We also finished with a desert of creme brulee. Yes the dinner was around 100 bucks, but it was worth it. We had ocean view and the service and food was to die for. The best fish I ever ate. I am avoiding MSG now everywhere.

http://www.truthinlabeling.org/hiddensources.html

Check out the above link(copy and paste it). There are so many ways brand names are tricking us with MSG. There are 20-30 names that are the same thing as MSG ,however, people only know one name MSG. I know all the tricks now and this link will show you that.


After dinner and walks on the water, we went to another couples house who we really like. I had a lot of drinks of whiskey and sprite. My wife had a vodka cranberry. She only had one because she was driving back. I am not going to lie to you all. I do indulge in adult cocktails here and there. I am responsible though with driving and weekdays of work. I enjoy a nice beer after work sometimes. Also, it gets the blood rushing in my wife sometimes so we can have a wild and crazy night together.

Things are great. please look at that MSG website so you can be schooled if you haven't already. Also, I will share something crazy we did since I am anonymous. We went to the mall in broad daylight. I parked at the very end of the parking lot. I was spontaneous and told my wife to go in the back seat and I had my way with her. I made it all about her though. As soon as she went, I stopped and we put our pants or shorts all. Then we went to the mall. Can you believe that? Good stuff....That was in the day today.

I'm gonna have to give you your own board - Your thread is a heck of a lot more interesting than the one on BCAA's!

Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on March 03, 2013, 11:02:41 pm
Peek. My wife thinks I should write a book. I love writing and I would like to start to write something in my spare time. Do you know any publishers that you can connect me with for a viewing? I am not asking for favors, but a referral. I have a lot of interesting things to say that a lot of people can relate to. What do you think?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on March 04, 2013, 07:50:18 am
Peek. My wife thinks I should write a book. I love writing and I would like to start to write something in my spare time. Do you know any publishers that you can connect me with for a viewing? I am not asking for favors, but a referral. I have a lot of interesting things to say that a lot of people can relate to. What do you think?

That's a great idea! 

I have absolutely no ties to the traditional publishing world but willl PM you with someone that I know who might be able to help and a few other ideas as well.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on March 04, 2013, 07:00:39 pm
Great. That sounds good.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on March 19, 2013, 03:34:26 pm
I cut 18 pounds in two months while maintaining all my strength. I feel amazing. My six pack is showing well, however, I still want to cut about 5 more pounds to be ripped. I run one mile 4 times a week before I lift waits. I still am taking 3 days off of working off. I run a mile in no problem in 7 minutes. Soon when summer hits, I am going to try to incorporate a day of swimming laps in the mornings.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on March 19, 2013, 03:43:06 pm
I run a mile in no problem in 7 minutes.

Impressive!  Keep up the good work and I'm sure you'll be ready for the combine in six months. 
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: haole on March 19, 2013, 05:08:14 pm
I cut 18 pounds in two months while maintaining all my strength. I feel amazing. My six pack is showing well, however, I still want to cut about 5 more pounds to be ripped. I run one mile 4 times a week before I lift waits. I still am taking 3 days off of working off. I run a mile in no problem in 7 minutes. Soon when summer hits, I am going to try to incorporate a day of swimming laps in the mornings.

Those are fantastic results!
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on March 20, 2013, 07:10:08 pm
I want to lose 5 more pounds. I feel like a kid again reborn. It's like going back in time and starting your first year of college for the first time. I been having a blast with my kids and wife everyday. I am so blessed. I wake up everyday and thank God for helping me find Peak and the pack here to show me the light. I run and lift and sweat like no tomorrow. I can honestly say that I am at the one of the highest points in my life, if not the highest point ever. Now I am on a mission that nobody can stop. My abs are washboard but I want a little more deep ripples in the washboard.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on April 11, 2013, 02:51:06 pm
New blood work is in folks. First of all, I maintained by weight loss and still working out 4 days a week in the mornings and FEEL GREAT. I stopped taking anti-depressents and stopped taking the Armidex around 6 months after I started it!!!

Cholesterol: 161
Triglycerides: 109
HDL: 48
LDL: 91
Risk Ratio LDL/HDL: 1.90
CK: 455 (I worked out that day hence a little higher.
Blood pressure: 183/67

FYI, this is all well within the normal range. This is the best results with cholesterol I HAVE EVER HAD IN MY LIFE THAT I CAN REMEMBER!!!

I do not eat at least 3 hours before I sleep and minimize all forms of MSG. I am feeling incredible. This week, I been doing quarter mile sprints at 10.0 mph four times to equal mile and after each one go straight to three weight training exercises on one or two specific muscles. I feel fast, cut and energetic. I am shocked I feel so good despite stopping the anti depressants.

After 8 days from the last T injection:
Total Testosterone: 1218
Free Testosterone: 34
Estrodiol 20

Doc said that I can lower my T injections to 1 CC every 2 weeks. Due to it being higher than last blood work, I feel like with my diet and exercise regimen my natural testosterone levels are rising!!!

RBC: 5.93
Hemoglobin: 17.9
Hemacratin: 51.7
Neutrophils: 76
Lymphocytes: 18

What are your thoughts all on these numbers or concerns?

Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Quincy on April 11, 2013, 03:05:53 pm
That sounds like awesome progress!

The only number that struck me, besides the high systolic BP was your hematocrit.. 51.7. I think the normal for males is somewhere around 45. If you go over 54, the docs will need to reduce it as it can cause high blood pressure, risk of stroke, heart attack, etc because your blood gets too thick with red blood cells. Reducing your T dosage is a way to reduce it. Also you can have a phlebotomy (blood drawn) to reduce the RBC.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on April 11, 2013, 06:47:24 pm
Quincy, very true. That is why she reduced my dose. I don't know if an intensive workout the morning of changes the way the number goes. 200mg at 1cc every 2 weeks of T-cypionate should do the trick. Another follow up appointment in 2 months with blood work again. I hate having to see the doctor every 2 months but she said that with hormone treatment, she has to monitor me regularly and closely...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on April 11, 2013, 09:21:35 pm
Anonymous:  Great news about the antidepressants.  Nice work and great to hear...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on April 22, 2013, 08:07:01 pm
I am feeling like a billion bucks. Over 20 pounds gone. I ran twice in the last week a mile at 9.0 speed which is a 6:40 miles. I am feeling awsome. Now I am incorporating squat jumps, lunges, mountain climbers adn hanging strap ab raises and knee raises. My six pack is there and outside stomach is close to gone. I want to even shoot for the stars more to push myself. I want to lose 5 more pounds and chissel my abs completely to show cut after cut. ANy recommendations? I know what to do but would like to hear others expert opinion if you are serious about fitness as I am...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on April 22, 2013, 08:25:13 pm
I am feeling like a billion bucks. Over 20 pounds gone. I ran twice in the last week a mile at 9.0 speed which is a 6:40 miles. I am feeling awsome. Now I am incorporating squat jumps, lunges, mountain climbers adn hanging strap ab raises and knee raises. My six pack is there and outside stomach is close to gone. I want to even shoot for the stars more to push myself. I want to lose 5 more pounds and chissel my abs completely to show cut after cut. ANy recommendations? I know what to do but would like to hear others expert opinion if you are serious about fitness as I am...
Congrats on doing so well.

If you're asking about abs, I am not having much luck.  I got to where the line was forming down the middle but got stuck.  Btw, I gained a 1/4 to 1/2 inch in my arms though during that time, so that part I can be proud of.  But I need more time to exercise as I HATE cutting calories.

I just despise the cutting part - I'm not sure how to get over that - and always want to try to build.  Somebody slap me!

Anyway, you tell me your secrets.  Sounds like just good old fashioned hard work, eh?

Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: fixme on April 23, 2013, 07:13:51 am
Hi Anonymous,

First, congrats! You've come a long way. Can you comment on your libido and sexual function? How was it working when you were low T, compared to now?

thanks
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: davie12 on April 23, 2013, 10:10:26 am
Hi Anonymous,

First, congrats! You've come a long way. Can you comment on your libido and sexual function? How was it working when you were low T, compared to now?

thanks

Yes, adding on to that question, is morning/nighttime wood intact, etc?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on April 24, 2013, 02:39:58 pm
Sorry for this late response, I have been busy with my kids playing at the park, taking them around the block, being dad and taking care of honey-dos.

Fixme/Davie, The answer the your question is that there is not much of morning wood, however, I do have sexual activity regularly at least 2-3 times a week. Strange because I don't have morning wood. I get excited upon physical interaction. I am doing everything by the book but that is the one thing that is not coming naturally regularly. My libido I would say is regular. I would have to say that the regular exercise and cutting processed foods and MSG made a major difference in that. When I had low T I did not even think about it and main goal was just to clear the dark heavy fog out of my head. I can tell you this, if I do not exercise, I start to feel irritated and negative so EXERCISE intense meaning don't just do the motions but push your lungs and muscles a lot.

Peak, back to the ABs subject. I would like to say that I am an expert. You can see the V in my abs now. Here are a couple good ones to follow:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KtDH26PvGV4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pW2jbKXMlEk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2dFcYWpWfS8
The above link has and isolated exercise that burns

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PEnPG_yrtr4
The above link is a great home ab workout

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KI8u58hPam4
Do these mountain climbers in above link. I do a set up 30 reps(60 both legs), take 15 seconds off, repeat. I do 4 sets


I do abs practically all in a row with no more than 15 seconds between sets. Obviously wait time between sets for weights are longer but treat abs different. Peak, don't focus on just crunches/sit-ups. LOWER ABS are the main target to hit. Let me know if you have any questions. Do those mountain climbers. They are a great cardio/fat burner and ab workout. You need to strengthen your abs more before you attempt the hanging strap ab raises that are in one of the links above.

Folks, we are have our areas of weakness needing improvement. Recognize them and improve them. We are only as strong as our weakest link.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on April 24, 2013, 02:50:39 pm
Sorry for this late response, I have been busy with my kids playing at the park, taking them around the block, being dad and taking care of honey-dos.

Fixme/Davie, The answer the your question is that there is not much of morning wood, however, I do have sexual activity regularly at least 2-3 times a week. Strange because I don't have morning wood. I get excited upon physical interaction. I am doing everything by the book but that is the one thing that is not coming naturally regularly. My libido I would say is regular. I would have to say that the regular exercise and cutting processed foods and MSG made a major difference in that. When I had low T I did not even think about it and main goal was just to clear the dark heavy fog out of my head. I can tell you this, if I do not exercise, I start to feel irritated and negative so EXERCISE intense meaning don't just do the motions but push your lungs and muscles a lot.

Peak, back to the ABs subject. I would like to say that I am an expert. You can see the V in my abs now. Here are a couple good ones to follow:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KtDH26PvGV4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pW2jbKXMlEk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2dFcYWpWfS8
The above link has and isolated exercise that burns

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PEnPG_yrtr4
The above link is a great home ab workout

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KI8u58hPam4
Do these mountain climbers in above link. I do a set up 30 reps(60 both legs), take 15 seconds off, repeat. I do 4 sets


I do abs practically all in a row with no more than 15 seconds between sets. Obviously wait time between sets for weights are longer but treat abs different. Peak, don't focus on just crunches/sit-ups. LOWER ABS are the main target to hit. Let me know if you have any questions. Do those mountain climbers. They are a great cardio/fat burner and ab workout. You need to strengthen your abs more before you attempt the hanging strap ab raises that are in one of the links above.

Folks, we are have our areas of weakness needing improvement. Recognize them and improve them. We are only as strong as our weakest link.

Thx for the tips.  Will watch later as I am at work...

Btw, the abs have made a little more progress in the last two days since I wrote that and I've put a half inch on my arms in the last month or so.  Intensity helped I think.  Anyway, I'll check out those links to maybe help me get down the final stretch...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on April 24, 2013, 04:38:18 pm
My biggest weakness is my lower back extra skin. I feel legs, abs and upper body are great but need to trim the excess from lower abs. I do lower back raises but I need to do more a little more variation to get the outer part of lower back. I also do seated rows. Its not fat but little squeeze of excess skin. Check out those videos though peak and let me know. You will ad some heavier artillery to your ab workout. Thats a promise.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: 7132gertie on April 28, 2013, 10:11:10 am
One other opinion, I apologize if it was addressed, but have you looked at Zoloft? There are a lot of discussions about anti-depressants affecting testosterone levels. It is interesting that there is not much clinical scientific evidence to prove, but why would big pharma fund a study to explore a potential side effect of its drug or any other organization that doesn't have the money to do a clinical trial. I have been on and off SSRIs for twenty years, and I suffer from low t. DO NOT STOP Zoloft or any medicine for that matter, I am not a doctor. Always consult the prescribing doctor if you want to stop. I decided to taper off my medications because of my chiropractor's determination to get me off medicine. And it has been a long and slow process. He contends that the body will heal if given the proper nutrition, exercise, etc. And he says the side effects are just too much.... Please look into this possibility.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on April 28, 2013, 10:17:21 pm
Sorry for this late response, I have been busy with my kids playing at the park, taking them around the block, being dad and taking care of honey-dos.

Fixme/Davie, The answer the your question is that there is not much of morning wood, however, I do have sexual activity regularly at least 2-3 times a week. Strange because I don't have morning wood. I get excited upon physical interaction. I am doing everything by the book but that is the one thing that is not coming naturally regularly. My libido I would say is regular. I would have to say that the regular exercise and cutting processed foods and MSG made a major difference in that. When I had low T I did not even think about it and main goal was just to clear the dark heavy fog out of my head. I can tell you this, if I do not exercise, I start to feel irritated and negative so EXERCISE intense meaning don't just do the motions but push your lungs and muscles a lot.

Peak, back to the ABs subject. I would like to say that I am an expert. You can see the V in my abs now. Here are a couple good ones to follow:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KtDH26PvGV4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pW2jbKXMlEk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2dFcYWpWfS8
The above link has and isolated exercise that burns

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PEnPG_yrtr4
The above link is a great home ab workout

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KI8u58hPam4
Do these mountain climbers in above link. I do a set up 30 reps(60 both legs), take 15 seconds off, repeat. I do 4 sets


I do abs practically all in a row with no more than 15 seconds between sets. Obviously wait time between sets for weights are longer but treat abs different. Peak, don't focus on just crunches/sit-ups. LOWER ABS are the main target to hit. Let me know if you have any questions. Do those mountain climbers. They are a great cardio/fat burner and ab workout. You need to strengthen your abs more before you attempt the hanging strap ab raises that are in one of the links above.

Folks, we are have our areas of weakness needing improvement. Recognize them and improve them. We are only as strong as our weakest link.

Great videos.  Really enjoyed them.  Thx for the posting.

The Rob Riches one brought out a great point that I need to face:  I've still got a stubborn mini-spare tire that I have to deal with.  The top 2 abs are showing and the line so I didn't realize that the last bit of fat would stay "down under". 

But I don't think I need to workout, believe it or not, my lower abs.  It's solid muscle there, so maybe I'm missing something, but again it's kind of protruding.

Anyway, thx for the info...

Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on May 02, 2013, 02:53:39 pm
7132gertie, I took Zoloft for about 2 years or near that time but recently stopped. I never felt I had any withdrawal and its been over a month. Doctor did not disagree. I feel just as great now as I did before. Working out is my anti-depressent. Nobody can solely depend on medicine and testosterone. There is a lot of mental issues going and if you are taking Testosterone. If you are taking testosterone and antidepressants and sit at home watch TV and sit on computer all day, don't think anyone is going to get anywhere. The answers always don't lie in medicine. It relies on lifestyle change. Good luck to you.

Peak, glad you enjoyed the videos. You said you don't think you need it, however, even if you hjave alright abs there is ALWAYS room for improvement. You can get a better core to your body, more flexibility and actually grow the muscles to your abs. It isn't always a matter of being thin and not having stubborn belly fat. That is great and all but you can improve. Don't be complacent with how things are. We can all improve even if we are number one or above average...
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on May 02, 2013, 03:46:48 pm

Peak, glad you enjoyed the videos. You said you don't think you need it, however, even if you hjave alright abs there is ALWAYS room for improvement. You can get a better core to your body, more flexibility and actually grow the muscles to your abs. It isn't always a matter of being thin and not having stubborn belly fat. That is great and all but you can improve. Don't be complacent with how things are. We can all improve even if we are number one or above average...

Sorry, I think I came across saying something I didn't mean to.  I just meant that I don't think I really want to grow my lower abs.  You'll see that advice quite commonly in bodybuilding zines since it does not look good to have too much muscle there.  I'm not quite sure how I did it, but that's what happened with me.  I do some pretty serious lat pulls so maybe that's it? 

But point well taken:  never get complacent and there is always room to climb a little higher....
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on June 20, 2013, 08:58:50 pm
New lab results are in: Cholesterol is perfect, testosterone is just above 1000, and estrodiol is at 14. Everything is intact. Blood pressure is great. For a moment I was worried about my libido, but still able to function. This last week I been on top of my game in the bedroom. We made love or fu....d at least 1 or 2 times a day for at least 5 days a week....and all successful. Working out 4 mornings a week still. Life is great. My wife says I am in the best shape I ever been in the whole time she has known me. My shots are lowered to .5 CC a week or 1 CC every two weeks since my readings have been high. I really dont have much bad news to say at this point. I been taking my kids out at least once a day for 1 to 3 hours an evening. Today I took them to an outdoor free concert with live reggae/rock music which was fun. I barely watch TV anymore, maybe 1 hour every other day. I just like to spend quality time with family. Work has been great and I am getting great appraisals and feedback from superiors and coworkers.

Thats my recent update for you peak. By the way, abs have been great. 6 pack is there and now the obliques are showing. My core body is right where i want it. Lower back raises, leg raises wioth straps, butt raises laying down and the list goes on and on...Any feedback from you all????
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on June 20, 2013, 09:52:39 pm
New lab results are in: Cholesterol is perfect, testosterone is just above 1000, and estrodiol is at 14. Everything is intact. Blood pressure is great. For a moment I was worried about my libido, but still able to function. This last week I been on top of my game in the bedroom. We made love or fu....d at least 1 or 2 times a day for at least 5 days a week....and all successful. Working out 4 mornings a week still. Life is great. My wife says I am in the best shape I ever been in the whole time she has known me. My shots are lowered to .5 CC a week or 1 CC every two weeks since my readings have been high. I really dont have much bad news to say at this point. I been taking my kids out at least once a day for 1 to 3 hours an evening. Today I took them to an outdoor free concert with live reggae/rock music which was fun. I barely watch TV anymore, maybe 1 hour every other day. I just like to spend quality time with family. Work has been great and I am getting great appraisals and feedback from superiors and coworkers.

Thats my recent update for you peak. By the way, abs have been great. 6 pack is there and now the obliques are showing. My core body is right where i want it. Lower back raises, leg raises wioth straps, butt raises laying down and the list goes on and on...Any feedback from you all????

Great story.  Very nice to hear.

I still think the E2 might be a little low, but if you feel good I can't imagine you getting bone loss with all the lifting you do!

Hey, my abs have improved still more but very slowly.  I have a solid line down to the navel now and a good outline of the abs on the sides.  But you got me beat.  I guess I need to ramp up my game!
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on July 05, 2013, 12:57:17 pm
I stopped taking my Armidex and going to take a break from it. I am starting to feel foggy in my head. My concentration and focus are not quite there. I know my T levels are intact. My assumption which may not be correct is I have too low of estrogen. Can anyone tell me how long I need to wait to get my Estrodiol levels to raise naturally to maybe 25 from 14?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on July 05, 2013, 01:12:46 pm
I stopped taking my Armidex and going to take a break from it. I am starting to feel foggy in my head. My concentration and focus are not quite there. I know my T levels are intact. My assumption which may not be correct is I have too low of estrogen. Can anyone tell me how long I need to wait to get my Estrodiol levels to raise naturally to maybe 25 from 14?

How's it going otherwise?  Hope you had a good 4th...

As you probably know, the half life of Arimidex is pretty short - around 48 hours I believe.  I don't have any studies to prove this, but I have noticed that when I have changed my Arimidex protocol, I can feel the difference in a day or two.  So, at least in my case, I am pretty sure my estradiol levels are changing pretty rapidly.  (I don't think it's a placebo effect.)
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: Sam on July 05, 2013, 08:39:03 pm
Anonymous,  are you taking and HCG?  What do you attribute to your ability to lower the amount of testosterone you inject?   I wonder if its partially because you are converting little to estrogen?

Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on July 11, 2013, 03:02:51 pm
Sam, I did convert to estrogen when I took 200mg of T-Cypionate a week. My estrodiol was close to 100, I don't remember exact number. I then took Armidex and with a couple months I got it down, then down then down to 14. I then stopped. My doctor told me to stop taking T shots because my last blood worrk my T levels were around 1250 and that was after 2 weeks from last injection with estrodiol at 14. Right now I stopped taking T shots and stopped Armidex. I am going to see what my levels are after 6 weeks from my last injection and Armidex dose. I actually feel better now that I stopped Armidex. I am still working out 4 days a week. Since my last post to this forum, I feel better. I do think having a really low estrogen level affects many things just like when you have very low T scores.

Peak, I had a blast on the 4th of July. I took the family to free live music and within a walk after music ended saw the fireworks. Family is doing great. My sex drive is still doing good. I just wanted to know more about affects of low estrogen levels. I know about having weak joints, muscles etc... and easy to get an injury, but I wanted to know more about affects on the brain when a man has very low estrogen.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on July 11, 2013, 03:35:49 pm
Going to low can affect you the same way the going to high can.   to that of low testosteron.

But I have a big question: I don't understand why you did not cut the does instead of eliminating it?

I have tweaked my dose a couple of times but it is by small amounts. And I think this is the safer way to go unless I'm missing something?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on July 30, 2013, 03:28:39 pm
Sorry Peak I took this long to respond. To answer your question is I did cut the dose and then cut it to nothing because the Doc recommended it but I just now received my latest lab results after 1 month of no Armidex or T-Cypionate. My testosterone is 145 and my estrodiol is 15. I feel a huge weight and fog in my head again. I been working our 4 times a week and eating right.  My cholesterol is slightly above normal.

I have my follow up doctor appointment tomorrow. Looks like my body cannot produce natural testosterone. Sucks because I was on track with levels and working out and I thought I would start producing natural T. I am 34 years old so based on my history of diet ing and exercising regularly, I will have to probably start once again and continue to inject the rest of my life. Estrodiol is at 15 so after I get prescription, I will take slim to no Armidex until it goes up a little to 20-25 or so. I just wanted to see where I stand by stopping for a month to do lab work again. I took two shots in the last week both of 1.5ml of 200mg to total 3 ml of 400mg. I wanted to get a heads start with the rest of the T I had from a month ago. The strange things is that its been over a week from one shot and the other yesterday and I still feel the heavy fog now. I figured it should be gone by now.

Is it the low 15 estrodiol that is giving me the heavy fog? I should feel fine now but don't. Do you have any clue to why I feel like this?


Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on July 30, 2013, 03:37:57 pm
Is it the low 15 estrodiol that is giving me the heavy fog? I should feel fine now but don't. Do you have any clue to why I feel like this?

A couple of comments:

--First of all, the steroid guys all use Clomid to try to jumpstart their testosterone.  You can't quit HRT for a couple of weeks and expect your testosterone to come back that fast imo.  I guess you weren't on HRT that long, but that's still too high of expectations.  Remember FightLowT?  He tried what you are doing with Clomid and it seemed like it was working for a months or so and then he drifted downward again.  But, anyway, you may want to get one of the real pros involved here if you're really trying to get your T back. 

I've got to be honest that I think almost all guys who end up low T will stay that way simply because we don't have a good way to jumpstart them.  It seems like there is damage involved generally and it's not something that just turns back on by itself.  Again, this is in contrast to most of the steroid guys who were fine before their cycle and then simply rev it back up again to previous levels.  In our case, the previous levels just weren't there.

--Question:  you gave yourself 2 200 mg doses in a week?  That's a lot.  And the reason you're probably feeling fog is the explosion of estradiol that you experienced.  Or am I missing something?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on July 30, 2013, 03:48:14 pm
I felt the fog before I took these two shots. Its been a month of nothing and I feel the same after taking these shots as I did before after a month of taking nothing. Seems like nothing has changed in my head. My impression is the recent shots got my T scores a boost, however, I believe the fog has to be from low estrodiol because after these shots I should of felt a jump.

After a long the entire year of working out regularly, eating a balance diet with fruits and vegis I thought my natural T would of been in the picture but I was sadly mistaken. If I felt like this before and a week after shots, then it has to be the estrodiol but I am no expert. Should I stop Armidex for a while. I am afraid of coversion of T to estrogen but maybe thats a good idea for a couple weeks to get my E2 in the 20s.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on July 30, 2013, 04:05:32 pm
To add to my previous comment, I dont think it comes down to which estrogen blocker to choose from. My estrodiol went from the 90s down to 14 so Armidex works. The problem is now just getting it back up which means stopping while I take T injections and seeing where it goes up to. After not taking T shots or Armidex, my T levels dropped low but estrodiol stayed the same and did not go up naturally from 14. To me this means stopping Armidex and letting the shot convert to estrogen a little bit higher. What do you think about that?
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on July 31, 2013, 07:07:57 am
Sam added a comment for you here about DHEA:

http://peaktestosterone.com/forum/index.php?topic=1927.0

I split it out, though, as I thought it was an interesting topic.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: anonymous11 on August 02, 2013, 11:05:44 am
I saw my doc. She put me back on 200mg of 1cc weekly. I follow up with her 8 Sept. I will do more lab work prior to see progress. I will let you know how I feel in about a week. I went to a different pharmacy and received individual bottles of 1cc so I received 4 vials for the month. I like that, not that it is any different.
Title: Re: Depression, High Cholesterol and Low T
Post by: PeakT on August 02, 2013, 11:32:47 am
I saw my doc. She put me back on 200mg of 1cc weekly. I follow up with her 8 Sept. I will do more lab work prior to see progress. I will let you know how I feel in about a week. I went to a different pharmacy and received individual bottles of 1cc so I received 4 vials for the month. I like that, not that it is any different.

Gotcha.  Let us know how it goes...