Peak Testosterone Forum

General Category => Testosterone, Hormones and General Men's Health => Topic started by: PeakT on January 31, 2015, 06:55:34 am

Title: Shock: FDA Writes Best Rebuttal of Anti-HRT Cardiovascular Studies
Post by: PeakT on January 31, 2015, 06:55:34 am
Hey, I have to say thx to Nelson Vergel for this one:

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Testosterone_FDA

Anyone on HRT or interested in HRT must read the FDA's letter where they go through and show one flaw after another in the HRT studies.

Let me know if you guys agree or disagree.  I thought the FDA did a great job and was sticking up for us guys on HRT...
Title: Re: Shock: FDA Writes Best Rebuttal of Anti-HRT Cardiovascular Studies
Post by: Regulus on January 31, 2015, 11:55:56 am
Hey, I have to say thx to Nelson Vergel for this one:

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Testosterone_FDA

Anyone on HRT or interested in HRT must read the FDA's letter where they go through and show one flaw after another in the HRT studies.

Let me know if you guys agree or disagree.  I thought the FDA did a great job and was sticking up for us guys on HRT...

Well, that explains why most of the ambulance-chasing ads for trt disappeared last summer!  :-)
Title: Re: Shock: FDA Writes Best Rebuttal of Anti-HRT Cardiovascular Studies
Post by: PeakT on January 31, 2015, 05:34:01 pm
Well, that and they've had two positive CVD studies.
Title: Re: Shock: FDA Writes Best Rebuttal of Anti-HRT Cardiovascular Studies
Post by: Reggielv on February 01, 2015, 01:51:43 am
Well, that and they've had two positive CVD studies.

 Read  this at US National Health Library of Medicine National Institutes of Health:
 
  "Testosterone deficiency and cardiovascular mortality"
Asian J  Androl
Men's Health Boston
Harvard Medical School.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25432501

Appears  to agree with FDA's rebuttal or maybe they used his Abstract (?)
Title: Re: Shock: FDA Writes Best Rebuttal of Anti-HRT Cardiovascular Studies
Post by: PeakT on February 01, 2015, 03:48:22 am
Well, that and they've had two positive CVD studies.

 Read  this at US National Health Library of Medicine National Institutes of Health:
 
  "Testosterone deficiency and cardiovascular mortality"
Asian J  Androl
Men's Health Boston
Harvard Medical School.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25432501

Appears  to agree with FDA's rebuttal or maybe they used his Abstract (?)

Woudn't surprise me.  Every guy on HRT should have Dr. Morgentaler's picture on their wall next to the wife and kids.
Title: Re: Shock: FDA Writes Best Rebuttal of Anti-HRT Cardiovascular Studies
Post by: Osprey on February 01, 2015, 05:11:46 am
It doesn't hurt that the data points in the direction that help's Big Pharma's bottom line.
Title: Re: Shock: FDA Writes Best Rebuttal of Anti-HRT Cardiovascular Studies
Post by: PeakT on February 01, 2015, 06:44:43 am
It doesn't hurt that the data points in the direction that help's Big Pharma's bottom line.

Yes, we really got lucky on this one.  Basically, they patented certain delivery systems on what is a very simple molecule.  This is what drove HRT to acceptability in our country - all the study work and doctor acceptance cuzz now it's a pharmaceutical.  But, fortunately, they never got rid of the old standard treatments, such as cypionate and compounded topicals, which are very inexpensive.

But, yes, you are absolutely right that the "HRT movement" has mostly been Big Pharma driven.  However, Morgentaler, as far as I know, is not connected with the pharmaceutical industry.  You may not remember this, but he wrote a book years ago about testosterone for the general reader that was significantly before the Androgel/Testim releases.  I'll have to research that, but I'm pretty sure I am right about that...
Title: Re: Shock: FDA Writes Best Rebuttal of Anti-HRT Cardiovascular Studies
Post by: Osprey on February 01, 2015, 03:56:47 pm
But, yes, you are absolutely right that the "HRT movement" has mostly been Big Pharma driven.  However, Morgentaler, as far as I know, is not connected with the pharmaceutical industry. 

From http://www.medpagetoday.com/Cardiology/Prevention/49811

Indeed, for this paper, Morgentaler disclosed relationships with AbbVie, Auxilium, Clarus Therapeutics, Endo Pharmaceuticals, TesoRx, Antares, Lipocine, Eli Lilly, Bayer, Pfizer, and MHB Labs.
Title: Re: Shock: FDA Writes Best Rebuttal of Anti-HRT Cardiovascular Studies
Post by: PeakT on February 01, 2015, 05:45:33 pm
Wow!  Okay, I stand corrected.  Thx...
Title: Re: Shock: FDA Writes Best Rebuttal of Anti-HRT Cardiovascular Studies
Post by: SteveT on February 03, 2015, 01:48:19 am
Never thought I would tip my hat to the FDA - good letter...

Steve
Title: Re: Shock: FDA Writes Best Rebuttal of Anti-HRT Cardiovascular Studies
Post by: PeakT on February 03, 2015, 04:17:15 am
Never thought I would tip my hat to the FDA - good letter...

Steve

Almost restores your faith in humanity, doesn't it?
Title: Re: Shock: FDA Writes Best Rebuttal of Anti-HRT Cardiovascular Studies
Post by: TopGeek on February 03, 2015, 11:11:41 am
On the other hand ... HRT is big business for the pharmaceutical industry with 'specialty' versions of testosterone esterisation. If the FDA was to concede to the petitioners, there would be a significant loss of big pharma revenue. Hand in glove???
Title: Re: Shock: FDA Writes Best Rebuttal of Anti-HRT Cardiovascular Studies
Post by: Rocco the Dog on February 03, 2015, 11:26:31 am
Just goes to show that a study on any subject can be manipulated to have a predetermined result.
Title: Re: Shock: FDA Writes Best Rebuttal of Anti-HRT Cardiovascular Studies
Post by: PeakT on February 03, 2015, 02:26:44 pm
Just goes to show that a study on any subject can be manipulated to have a predetermined result.

Yes, but here is my two cents:

I have a very cautious and "old school" urologist.  He had never even heard of Morgentaler.  This was a little over a year ago when the anti-HRT study had just come out.  He said, "I don't believe that study.  I have been giving testosterone for over five years and I've never had a case."

So I think he thought they were nuts.  In my article I list some examples of guys that have to be ultra careful and consult with their docs:

a) men with clotting disorders
b) men with hypertension
c) men whose hematocrit/hemoglobin rises too high

So, sure, some men might have some exposure.  But my old clinic was raising guys testosterone generally three times their old baseline.  We should have all been dropping like flies if testosterone was really an issue. 

Of course, there may be certain protocols or delivery systems that have issues for some guys.  But the flip side is that it is also risky to be low testosterone.  Staying low T increases your risk for diabetes, Metabolic Syndrome, hardening of the arteries, depression, erectile dysfunction which is the subject of my book:

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Low_Testosterone_By_The_Numbers

Anyway, time will tell, eh?