Peak Testosterone Forum

General Category => Testosterone, Hormones and General Men's Health => Topic started by: jsr0367 on March 01, 2015, 10:40:53 pm

Title: DOC HORROR STORY: Estradiol of 59 pg/ml Is Not Excessive
Post by: jsr0367 on March 01, 2015, 10:40:53 pm
I am a 48 year old male with low T. In December my total testosterone was 77 which prompted my Urologist to prescribe Test. Cyp 1CC weekly which is 200MG weekly. Up until a week ago I was doing well. No more ED and libido was like a dog in heat. Stacking on lots of mucle too. Testosterone levels are responding nicely at 933. Doctor said to reduce dosage.

This week I noticed some of my symptoms have changed. I now have low libido, ED, erect nipples all the time. Doctor did a Testosterone and I was at 633 with Estradiol at 59. It is hard to tell how much weight is muscle and fat but I do see more belly fat.

Has anyone experienced this and what has worked? I think my doctor may be having me go twice a week.

Title: Re: DOC HORROR STORY: Estradiol of 59 pg/ml Is Not Excessive
Post by: PeakT on March 01, 2015, 10:52:54 pm
I am a 48 year old male with low T. In December my total testosterone was 77 which prompted my Urologist to prescribe Test. Cyp 1CC weekly which is 200MG weekly. Up until a week ago I was doing well. No more ED and libido was like a dog in heat. Stacking on lots of mucle too. Testosterone levels are responding nicely at 933. Doctor said to reduce dosage.

This week I noticed some of my symptoms have changed. I now have low libido, ED, erect nipples all the time. Doctor did a Testosterone and I was at 633 with Estradiol at 59. It is hard to tell how much weight is muscle and fat but I do see more belly fat.

Has anyone experienced this and what has worked? I think my doctor may be having me go twice a week.

Welcome to the board.  I'll start out by saying, "Ouch!"  That's high estradiol and it sounds like that was during your trough, so you're probably significantly higher than that peak.

Now my first comment is that that is a very high dose of cypionate.  Most of the guys on here take around 100 mg/week, so 200 will be a massive amount for almost all guys.  Estradiol issue tend to take a month or two oftentimes to become noticeable, and I'm not sure why.  So what is happening to you, in general, is pretty typical.

So how can you bring that estradiol number down naturally?  Here is how I did it and remember that my original HRT clinic started me out very high at 150 mg/week:

1.  Lower your dose.  I am currently at 80 mg/week and doing great.  Again, most guys are about 100 mg/week.

2.  Go to injections twice per week or more.  This is almost always done subQ.  So, in my case, I inject 40 mg/dose twice weekly.

3.  Lose weight.  I am no sitting at 10.5% body fat on my Tanita Scale (athletic mode).  Realistically, I think I am about 12% body fat based on pictures, but you got the idea.  Get some definition on your abs and get rid of those love handles.

Another question for you:  how long do you think you were low testosterone?  That was very low testosterone, so I'm asking for a reason.
Title: Re: DOC HORROR STORY: Estradiol of 59 pg/ml Is Not Excessive
Post by: jsr0367 on March 02, 2015, 02:56:47 am
I have been low for about 10 years. I did Test early on and did doses every three weeks but the rage was terrible so I went off. Last December I herniated a disc in my back and my doctors felt it was time for a relook. At 77 they strongly urged me to go on TRT.

I am planning on talking with my doctor this week to address these issues. He is very thorough but I am also a very anal patient and can be the squeaky wheel.

My pharmacist recommeneded the shots go twice a week at smaller doses.

I thought the estro was high.
Title: Re: DOC HORROR STORY: Estradiol of 59 pg/ml Is Not Excessive
Post by: PeakT on March 02, 2015, 05:53:00 am
Let us know what he says.
Title: Re: TRT Newbie with Estradiol Issues
Post by: jsr0367 on March 03, 2015, 12:32:17 am
Spoke with my doctor this evening. He said that 59 is not excessive wants to wait a couple weeks as it may stabilize as he just reduced the dose last week. He prefers a conservative approach he told me.
Title: Re: DOC HORROR STORY: Estradiol of 59 pg/ml Is Not Excessive
Post by: Hydranted on March 03, 2015, 01:26:24 am
What is your new dose/protocol?
Title: Re: DOC HORROR STORY: Estradiol of 59 pg/ml Is Not Excessive
Post by: jsr0367 on March 03, 2015, 01:51:55 am
.75cc once a week for now.
Title: Re: TRT Newbie with Estradiol Issues
Post by: PeakT on March 03, 2015, 02:00:08 am
Spoke with my doctor this evening. He said that 59 is not excessive wants to wait a couple weeks as it may stabilize as he just reduced the dose last week. He prefers a conservative approach he told me.

Well, it's great he tried to reduce it.  My opinion is that 59 is not a good and here is just one of the many reasons:

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Estradiol_Arterial_Plaque

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Normal_Estradiol_Levels_Men
Title: Re: DOC HORROR STORY: Estradiol of 59 pg/ml Is Not Excessive
Post by: Hydranted on March 03, 2015, 02:11:53 am
.75cc once a week for now.


How long after last injection were your last labs drawn (the one where you had a TT in the 900's and E2 at 59)?
Title: Re: DOC HORROR STORY: Estradiol of 59 pg/ml Is Not Excessive
Post by: Sam Duxbury on March 06, 2015, 11:33:35 pm
are you taking an oral aromatase inhibitor such as Letrozol or Arimidex?
Title: Re: DOC HORROR STORY: Estradiol of 59 pg/ml Is Not Excessive
Post by: jsr0367 on April 10, 2015, 04:00:24 pm
Recent blood tests are in.

Estradiol: 34
Testosterone: 464
PSA: 3.29
Hematocrit: 50
MCHC: 33

Waiting to hear from the doc on these but wanted to hear from those on this forum.

My PSA went from 2.79 to 3.29 which I didn't think was too bad. Is the PSA going to stay about that level or will it continue to nose up?
It is nice to see the Estradiol down to a lower level. Hematocrit seems a little on the high side. Any thoughts on this?

Hope to hear from others.
Title: Re: DOC HORROR STORY: Estradiol of 59 pg/ml Is Not Excessive
Post by: timmy11 on April 10, 2015, 05:32:18 pm
May have heard already but donate blood to help with hematocrit. 
Title: Re: DOC HORROR STORY: Estradiol of 59 pg/ml Is Not Excessive
Post by: VinnAY on April 10, 2015, 09:08:29 pm
200mg a week is not "massive", it's just not. Steroid cycles of 3/4/500mg  and more are massive doses.

If your Dr is in any way smart I'd bet he pulls you off due to your PSA number which bears more careful examination. I think everything else is a moot point due to your PSA.
Title: Re: DOC HORROR STORY: Estradiol of 59 pg/ml Is Not Excessive
Post by: PeakT on April 10, 2015, 10:20:29 pm
Recent blood tests are in.

Estradiol: 34
Testosterone: 464
PSA: 3.29
Hematocrit: 50
MCHC: 33

Waiting to hear from the doc on these but wanted to hear from those on this forum.

My PSA went from 2.79 to 3.29 which I didn't think was too bad. Is the PSA going to stay about that level or will it continue to nose up?
It is nice to see the Estradiol down to a lower level. Hematocrit seems a little on the high side. Any thoughts on this?

Hope to hear from others.
It's probably inflammation but you have to watch it.  Hard to say whether it will go up or down.

Docs/clinics will have guidelines before you need urological clearance.  That's what happened to me!
Title: Re: DOC HORROR STORY: Estradiol of 59 pg/ml Is Not Excessive
Post by: jsr0367 on April 11, 2015, 10:59:11 am
He didn't seem concerned with the PSA because it was around that value without the TRT. He did evaluate it and put me on Cipro back in November long before TRT which brought the number down a bit. He did an US and Cytoscopy which showed nothing. He said he is not concerned and at 48 the PSA is WNL.
Title: Re: DOC HORROR STORY: Estradiol of 59 pg/ml Is Not Excessive
Post by: VinnAY on April 11, 2015, 01:04:09 pm
He didn't seem concerned with the PSA because it was around that value without the TRT. He did evaluate it and put me on Cipro back in November long before TRT which brought the number down a bit. He did an US and Cytoscopy which showed nothing. He said he is not concerned and at 48 the PSA is WNL.

This from the guy that told you 59 isn't a high estrogen reading and shoots you with 200mg a week...sigh
Title: Re: DOC HORROR STORY: Estradiol of 59 pg/ml Is Not Excessive
Post by: PeakT on April 11, 2015, 06:51:10 pm
He didn't seem concerned with the PSA because it was around that value without the TRT. He did evaluate it and put me on Cipro back in November long before TRT which brought the number down a bit. He did an US and Cytoscopy which showed nothing. He said he is not concerned and at 48 the PSA is WNL.

Well, PSA is not the greatest test.  Basically, with a number as high as yours, my understanding is that it is saying that you probably have either inflammation, prostatitis or actual prostate cancer.  And my number went up to 6.3 from about 1.4, so I've been through the war with this.  (I'm down to 1.9 per my last read - whew!)  Now a high percentage of men over 40 will have prostate cancer nodules - we are just very vulnerable to this with a Western lifestyle - but I don't believe a small nodule or two will really raise your PSA.  But a decent sized nodule, prostatitis and inflammation will all really raise it.  I have also read that some men just tend to have higher PSA's for reasons that are poorly understood.

But, if I had a PSA in the 3's like yourself, I would work my rear off to keep everything under control - inflammation and PC in particular.  It does not appear that I have prostate cancer since my PSA has gone way down and they found actual inflammation in the prostate via a biopsy along with no cancer or precancerous cells.  But I pretend that I have PC, because there is a good chance that I have one of those small nodules just based on my past Western lifestyle.  I'm married with three kids, so I take it seriously. 

I have a considerable amount of material here if you are int'd:

http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Hdr_Prostate_Vasectomy_Fertility