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1

Testosterone, Hormones and General Men's Health / Re: Oddly high test results causing problems

« on: June 16, 2017, 07:35:20 pm »

Good thinking, on clearing out before Low T Man makes his appearance    I agree with what other guys are saying here, about just paying cash, unless this is just a one time thing.  But typically guys will get bloodwork every 6 months.  So if his insurance is essentially requiring him to stop treatment every six months, that is not something I would want to go through.

But to answer your questions, it takes a full 6 weeks for the testosterone to build up fully (although most of that in crease is in the first 3 weeks).  But 200 mg is a hefty dose.  So that first injection may be enough to stop any serious symptoms, even if it will take a while longer before he is at 100%.  (But everyone is different, so that is just a guess on my part.).

Thank you for the info Boxcar. And everyone who has replied. 

I don't think the insurance would require him to stop every six months but you never know with those guys.  I believe that it all just happened at the wrong time. If the insurance hadn't been brand new and wanting preauthorization I don't think it would have been a big deal.  I assume the dr would have just adjusted the dosage and retested agian in six months and gone from there. 

But to me it also appears that it would be much less headache to self pay for the testosterone and not let the insurance company dictate his health options anyway.  And we already pay about 25 dollars a month for his Rx even when the insurance is supposedly covering it so the monetary difference is either negligible or would be cheaper out of our pocket in the long run anyway. And especially if I can find it even cheaper at a pharmacy that will dispense the 10ml vials.

Maybe we will just let the Dr handle it all without insurance interference and call it good. 

Thanks again Guys it is always a pleasure and a learning experience in this forum.

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Testosterone, Hormones and General Men's Health / Re: Oddly high test results causing problems

« on: June 16, 2017, 05:56:07 pm »

That sounds kind of ridiculous. I've had 5 ml vials with an expiration date two years out. BTW, looking at goodrx.com, for 10 ml vials they are mentioning Walgreens, CVS, Rite-Aid, Target, Costco, Kroger, Wal-Mart, Safeway and Kmart. Prices range from $45 to $95. Call in advance to see if they will honor the coupon.

Thank you Cataceous. I just found a local compounding pharmacy that will dispense a 10ml vial as long as the script is written that way. Their price is 103.55 but at his current dose that is only 20 dollars per month so I am ok with that but will continue to call around.   We have previously tried to get it filled that way and been refused at Walgreens and Walmart and most recently (yesterday) CVS. So it sounds like a change of Pharmacy is needed.

Also Hubby says he is willing to go 3 weeks and retest to have the diagnosis correct with the insurance company (I am planning an upcoming trip so I told him he has to do that while I am gone ) But will that just be a couple of weeks feeling crappy and then resuming the shots will help again or will it take time to build up and level out again?

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Testosterone, Hormones and General Men's Health / Re: Oddly high test results causing problems

« on: June 16, 2017, 04:44:47 pm »

I believe it is more the insurance companies limiting the use of the larger vials.  So, if your doctor will write the script and you purchase it out of pocket, I think you can bypass all the red tape.

I went and picked up the Rx yesterday and paid out of pocket and when I got home I realized it was only 1ml so I called and spoke with the pharmacist and he told me that a 10ml vial is only good for 30 days once punctured and that he couldn't dispense it that way for a script that was only 2 mls per month.

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Testosterone, Hormones and General Men's Health / Re: Oddly high test results causing problems

« on: June 16, 2017, 04:29:48 pm »

Thank you Guys for the replies. I agree that its not right for insurance companies to have the final say about our health. 

We don't mind paying out of pocket but where do you find a pharmacy that will dispense a 10ml vial?

His doctor always writes the Rx to be dispensed as a 10ml vial because he said it is cheaper for us in the long run to buy 3 10mls a year vs 40 1mls but the pharmacy wont fill it that way.  That has been an ongoing battle as well because the Dr says they have to dispense it the way it is written but the pharmacist says they don't have to. And the refills are the same number so we end up having to call the dr for refill way earlier than should have been needed and that makes it look like we are over using. And then to have a really high test result.... UGH

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Testosterone, Hormones and General Men's Health / Oddly high test results causing problems

« on: June 16, 2017, 03:36:10 pm »

Hi all,
I haven't been on in a while because things have been going well with hubby's T for several years now.  He has been on 1ml every 9 days of 200mg testosterone since he started the injections after trying testopel in 2013.  He has bloodwork every 6 months and his testosterone level is usually around 500.

He saw his Dr a few weeks ago and the testosterone level came back at 1500.  We are not sure why this happened but the Dr asked him to back off to 1 ml every 14 days and retest in 6 months.  We are in agreement with the DR that if this test was correct, that is way too high even for the peak after injection.  But we did decide to give the injection at .5ml weekly instead of waiting 14 days. 

As it happens hubby's employer just switched to a new insurance company and since this is the first time filling the Rx on the new insurance they wanted a preauthorization.  Well they denied the claim because they said that he no longer fits the diagnosis of Hypogonadism with a test result of 1500 so they will not cover the medicine. This is like telling him to stop taking his blood pressure meds because his blood pressure is normal while he is on them. 

And even if we sent them his other recent test results they are within the normal range and it would not be approved.   So our options at this point are to pay out of pocket for the injections and retest in 5 more months at the new dose  (at which point it will also not be approved if normal) or stop using the testosterone long enough to let his levels go down to nothing again and retest when his symptoms return.

So assuming this test was accurate how long would he have to be off of the testosterone to let the levels get below the normal range and when he starts the injections again will he have the same issues with e2 to deal with or would it still be somewhat leveled out

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Testosterone, Hormones and General Men's Health / Re: Need help comparing dosages between delivery methods

« on: June 29, 2013, 04:10:55 pm »

Thank you PeakT.

On the injections, Hubby seemed to feel like he needed another shot on day 9. He felt pretty good until then. And he had similar problems to JinNe with the insertion of the pellets. His safety equipment at work rubbed the site and made it sore for a few weeks and it became infected, very swollen and hard and he had lots of drainage. He had to be on antibiotics for 10 days.

We did discuss all of this with the doctor yesterday and he is open to changing to a fewer day cycle on the shots or increasing the number of pellets next time.

This doctor doesn't talk like he is shooting for very high numbers with the pellets though. (like 400-450) He is of the opinion that if the testosterone is too high that the E2 is just automatically too high. Now my understanding was that the high E2 came from raising the test quickly when you didn't have hardly any and the rate your body converts it to E2. I know it can be  treated with Arimidex but I have seen it said that it will eventually level out and most people are able to stop the Arimidex. 

He is expecting the pellets to be effective for about 6 months. He also is not even considering any other action until Hubby has had the pellets for 4 months. That is when he will have more bloodwork.

Of course we will be contacting him before then if Hubby feel like he has gone downhill.

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Testosterone, Hormones and General Men's Health / Need help comparing dosages between delivery methods

« on: June 29, 2013, 04:27:46 am »

After our axiron failure Hubby was taking injections for about 2 1/2 months while waiting for insurance approval for Testopel. He has had the Testopel now for one month (which doc says should be about the highest level) and doesn't feel as good as when he was taking the injections.

The doctor did bloodwork today and we are waiting for the results but since he didn't do any bloodwork while he was taking the injections we have no way to compare the actual levels to those of the Testopel. So I would like to try and determine if the dosages would be comparable.

If anyone can help I would appreciate it.

Injections were 200mg of test cyp every 10 days

Testopel insertion was 12 pellets

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Testosterone, Hormones and General Men's Health / Re: Needle Size to Draw Versus Inject (Cypionate)

« on: March 28, 2013, 09:50:12 pm »

Keep fightin' the fight!  From all us low T and formerly low T guys out there, our hats are off to you!

But you do need to assume the Lotus position.  You're gonna make him nervous if you're watching him like a field biologist on one of those documentaries. 

LOL I'm trying! That lotus position is sometimes a tough one. But I do feel like I am watching my sloth try to make it a foot and saying a little hurrah in my head if I see one off the toes slowly lift off of the branch! Ha Ha

Ken I understand it is a little more awkward to have it upside down and it is lots easier to draw medicine that way when you have a full bottle of something and you are only using a little of it at a time instead of trying to draw out every last drop.

Quincy, Thank you for the explanation about the half life and your input on the needle size. If we should happen to continue with the shots we will definitely get smaller needles.

Thank you all for your encouragement. I only hope I can be as encouraging to others as we go through this process and learn more.

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Testosterone, Hormones and General Men's Health / Re: Needle Size to Draw Versus Inject (Cypionate)

« on: March 28, 2013, 05:23:14 pm »

Quincy & Ken, Thank you for the great replies.

Quincy he gets the whole vial 1ml I believe that is the same as 1cc

  You want the 1-1/2 inch length to reach the bottom of the vial as to not waste any precious T.

Ken Do you leave the vial upright when you draw it out? I always turn it upside down to draw out the medicine for injections. Then it doesn't require a long needle. You just pull the needle out of the vial so that only the open tip of it is through the rubber. Then you can get it all out (almost)

They didn't give me any pointers on giving the shots but I am very familiar with giving injections so it wasn't really necessary. Nice description from you by the way. One other thing I would mention if giving it in the glut is to put your weight on the other leg so the hip you are giving the injection in is completely relaxed.

Hubby said it was a little tender last night before bedtime but he can't feel where it was injected today.

He seems to be in a really good mood today (not the norm) but he said it is because he slept good last night (also not the norm)

I hope these are good signs but i'm also trying not to let this shot have a placebo effect on my observations. But he doesn't really pay much attention to how he is feeling most of the time so I would say he will have to have a total transformation to admit that it is really helping. That is just his personality though. (or maybe that is just his low T personality)

That's also why we went so long using the Axiron because he would just say it might be helping or it might not. Maybe I feel a little better, Maybe not.  Turns out it was NOT.

Its hard to tell with him sometimes so I would love for him to see a noticeable change.

I know weekly would be better but we were just so excited to finally have some real T getting into the system that I didn't want to rock the boat since we are only doing the injections a couple of times anyway. Some days I just don't feel like fighting the battle so hard. But if we should have a reason to stay with injections (insurance doesn't approve Testopel or hubby doesn't like the procedure, etc.) I will fight for injections every week instead of 10 days.

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Testosterone, Hormones and General Men's Health / Re: How Quickly Does Estradiol Rise on HRT?

« on: March 28, 2013, 02:45:49 pm »

thanks PeakT
The doctor did say he is going to monitor the E2 but we don't have any tests scheduled yet. I think he is planning to test everything again when we go in to get the testopel.

It will probably be 2 - 3 weeks. Is that too long to wait?

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Testosterone, Hormones and General Men's Health / How Quickly Does Estradiol Rise on HRT?

« on: March 28, 2013, 01:07:45 pm »

his e2 was at 23 before the injection but we do want to make sure it stays below about 30. How quickly does it go up? I guess what i mean by that is... we should see some improvement before the E2 rises  right am I correct in assuming it wont rise fast enough to cancel out the benefits before we even see them?

I don't know when Doc is planning on checking it again but he is planning on checking.

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Testosterone, Hormones and General Men's Health / Re: Axiron?

« on: March 28, 2013, 12:58:56 pm »

My Husband was on Axiron for a little over a year and it didn't work for us.
Our new doctor told us that some people just don't absorb the gels  as well and we are doing injections now and testopel when it gets approved by our insurance.

The copay card is a must for the Axiron though. For us it was going to be about $300 without it.

Good luck with whichever you try.

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Testosterone, Hormones and General Men's Health / Re: Needle Size to Draw Versus Inject (Cypionate)

« on: March 28, 2013, 02:01:45 am »

Thank you guys for your responses. I was able to confirm that you draw with the larger needle (smaller number) and inject with the smaller needle.

We made it through the first shot and he said I didn't hurt him at all giving the injection but that it burned a little when he started to walk away. like when he put weight on the side I did the injection. Is that normal?

Also, I asked him to give me voluntary feedback from time to time about if he notices any difference or if he doesn't because I don't want him to feel like I am pestering him about it all of the time.

But can you guys tell me what day in this ten 10 cycle the test level will be the highest?

I am trying not to be impatient or expect too much. It is really hard. 

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Testosterone, Hormones and General Men's Health / Re: Needle Size to Draw Versus Inject (Cypionate)

« on: March 27, 2013, 08:15:58 pm »

Ok so we got in touch with Doc #2 and we are going to try the Testopel. But while we wait for insurance pre-approval, He is letting hubby take injections.

He prescribed Test Cyp 200mg/1ml every ten days and he will be on that until the Testopel insertion. I will be giving the injections at home.

He gave us 2 different sized needles one to draw and one to inject but i'm not sure which is which. We have 20 and 21 guage. I would assume the larger 20 would be used to draw and the smaller to inject.  Anybody got any ideas? I am waiting on a call back from the doctor but I haven't heard from him yet?

Here's hoping the magic happens!!!

I hope we see a big difference right away.

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Testosterone, Hormones and General Men's Health / Re: More Doubts Cast on Paleo Diet Assumptions

« on: March 26, 2013, 05:50:47 pm »

Aaahhhh the things we put in our bodies....

Being raised on a farm and witnessing firsthand the total nastiness of pigs one should instinctively know that NO part of them should ever be ingested. But, I consider Bacon one of my most sinful desires. Its a wonder I'm alive to tell about it.

Sorry for the hijack I was just reminiscing.