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Messages - charliebizz

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1
trt Has a negative effect on me mentally the longer Iím on the more I started to lose interest in hobbies. My old anxiety started to come back. But I also never felt right on trt period. I tried many different protocols with dr Crisler. Still so much we do not know about how having your htpa out of wack from being on trt does to us long term. But it also depends on protocol and the person themselves we are all so different and react different to medical intervention. Just too many variables to give an answer.

2
Your 15 years older then me and my t for years has been 240-350. Last test it came back 240. For what itís worth trt never had much if any positive effect on me. It also caused a host of negative side effects. Iím not saying it couldnít help you cause we are all different. But just keep in mind trt isnít some easy magical road to be on.

3
What is ďserotonin syndrome?Ē

It is interesting to know that even super low dose ssri cause brain zaps and withdrawal symptoms!  Only further proves to me that these drugs should be avoided or used as last resort and at mowest possible doses if used at all!

19 weeks of significant withdrawls and insomnia is horrible.

My wife alreasy has insomnia issues! In fact I think the lack of sleep is perpetuating the depression/anxiety. So it is a downward spiral.

I recently read article on drugs to help sleep. The people also report severe addition or withdrawal symptoms, and the average additional sleep that is provided by these wonder drugs is UNDER 22 MINUTES!   All the costs and side effects and possible addition/withdrawal for 22 MINUTES!  Seriously!
lets be honest here. Almost all medical intervention has side effects and usually when you remove the meds you go back to your previous state. They are all work arounds and bandaids. Even trt. Itís toted as natural when it is not even close. I personally have had way worse side effects from hrt/trt  then ssris. And other people have had opposite results then me. We are all so different

4
Current Regimen:

Daily propionate IM injection 9mg/day
50 mg prengenolone /day

TEST RESULT ó RANGE
Hormonal
testosterone total 733 ó 350 - 1000
testosterone free 21.9 ó 9.3-26.5
SHBG 22 ó 10.0-57.0
Estradiol sensitive 37ó 8.0-35.0
DHEA S 254.1 ó138.5 - 475.2
Progesterone 0.4 ó 0.0-0.5
prolactin 8.1 ó 4-15.2
DHT 50 ó 30-85
Other
Free t3 (thyroid) 4 Normal 2-4.4
TSH 2.17 Normal 0.45-0.4500
A1C (diabetes) 5.2 Normal 4.8-5.6
Total cholesterol 127 LOW <200

END RESULT: 85% of the time im basically completely impotent Ö cant have sexÖ no relationshipsÖ almost never get morning wood, numb dick
anything else i need to look into?

HAVE TRIED:
AI: Doesnt do anything good for me
hcg: Seems to only make things worse
Cypionate: Seems to only make things worse

I need maybe some real deeper insightÖIf anyone could help offer any insight or maybe what else to check that would be greatly appreciated
did you have those symptoms before trt ?

5
Better how so can you elaborate?
more energy less fatigue and brain fog.

6
That's really good news. I'm sure getting off the SSRIs was not a trivial endeavor. I think it will be better if you try to focus on the future; we should remember our past mistakes but not dwell on them too much.
Very happy that your feeling better. Ssri have there place. I truly believe itís all about dose though. Iím on a super low dose and have no side effects at all. I believe most people are on way to much and they run into problems like you were. But shit even better for you that you are completely. Off.

And coming off can be rough. I always thought people amp up the side effects from reading about coming off but. Man even when I come off low dose brain zaps are real. I only take ssri for energy issues. From reading dr Marianoís work over the years ssri help me with low cortisol type issues.

But in the near future I will come off again just to see where Iím at because I would rather be 100% natural.
 Very wise words Cataceous!

Good for you Stepcurryftw, keep the momentum going.

I have counted ( I journal how I am doing) and I've been on a total of 59 medicine tapers in that time going on and off medicines.  6 of those were Effexor XR tapers with about 19 weeks of brain zaps, 44 weeks of serotonin syndrome, over 250 nights of insomnia and nightmares, about 2.5 years of issues with weight and high cholesterol, and over 7 years of high prolactin, low SHBG, and low testosterone in the mid 100's for about 5 years and I'm only 23 years old :) 

I now feel ready to do well in undergraduate even though I've graduated, BUT WAIT, I've already lost ALL that time in my life from being overmedicated! Yay...

7
I feel much better since quoting lifting a few years ago. I do cardio and play competitive hockey 1-2 times a week. 

8
I also love how people really think the labs currently available to us are the end all be all. There are so many biological processes in the body that go on that we have absolutly no testing for.

9
There are many other factors that can play impotence. People need to remember that TRT can help but not always cure it. Depression/anxiety plays a factor. Being a smoker or a drinker or taking recreational drugs can bring on impotence. Having high cholesterol or hypertension, taking certain meds like Xanax, ssri and etc. Diet can even play a factor. Everyone is different, I take Paxil but have a strong sex drive, even before TRT.
i also take ssri and no impotence at all. Dose is the key to ssri use as any other medication.

10
it really feels hormonal.... I got dry tired eyes to go with it. I have lost my sense of calmness. Before Inside my body felt so calm and deep breathing etc. Now its like I have breathing issues , tight scrotum, numb genitals, and its like its causing anxiety...
no one in this forum is going to be able to tell you whatís going on. Hormones and nt are so intertwined. I for sure thought mine was hormonal also and it very well can be a mix but I know from experience. Iíve treated almost every hormone and going that route caused nothing but negative sides for me. Iím very sensitive to hormonal shifts. And I can tell you for me personally low dose ssri is the only thing that has helped me. And trt has been an absolute life saver for other men on the boards. Only thing you can do is try things.

You canít be afraid of any of it. Everything I tried I always returned to my baseline shortly after so itís nothing to fear. I quite trt a few times and didnít have the crash many men speak of. But I also never had the high of trt either. These forums are a great help but also can cause so many unnecessary fears and worryís. Iím not sitting on my high horse itís taken me close to 10 years to finally get to a point weíre i can say that Iím ok with how my health is. Am I optimal. Not by a long shot but Iím done trying to search for that. I feel ok for a 36 year old. And if you asked me 10 years ago Iíd feeling ok would be good enough I would have said fuck yeah I was really bad when this first started. Hope that helps any one at all. I still have lower libido and eq then optimal. But other things help that one puff of marijuana makes me feel like Iím 17 in the bedroom again. So that shows me itís more then just hormones.

11
I went through a very similar situation as you in my mid 20s. Now 36. I believe the crash diet effected my cortisol levels greatly. After my crash diet gaining weight back and eating normal only made me feel a little better . Then I had to cut out hard training to get to next level. Still didnít feel normal. Tried trt a bunch of times with dr john Crisler. Trt made a lot of my symptoms worse because it lowered my already low normal cortisol. Taking a low dose ssri was the biggest leap in my health journey. I still am no where near 100% but Iím doing ok.  Orgasms and spontaneous erections have never fully recovered. I get night and morning wood often. Never really have spontaneous erections during the day. Trt also didnít help with any of that much.

It can get better and I wouldnít say life is over itís just going to be different. I hope you can fully recover. Iím still searching for a full recovery. But Iím doing much better.

12
Nobody on a forum can tell you what will work. Only way is to try it yourself. I also do not believe 550 is low for your age. It may be low for you. And may be great for someone else your age. I for one fluctuate between 290-390. Iíve tried trt a few times. Was a patient of dr crislers and we tried every single trt trick around and i never felt better on it then off. I felt slight improvement in energy but it made many other things worse. Like sleep and mental side effects. Even with low t issues I still had fun and was motivated. On trt I really start to lose motivation and my emotions are up and down. And no rhyme or reason to how I feel day by day. Over at excel make a bunch of guys share same story. That said many guys have gotten their life back on trt. If you feel youíre not yourself try it out. I have always returned to baseline even quitting trt cold turkey. And for me getting off isnít that hard.

Hope that didnít come across as me bashing trt. Just for me personally itís too complicated. And our body is so complex imo fixing one hormone that throws other out of wack is far from optimal.

13
Trt significantly lowers my cortisol unless I take ssri with trt

14
Very conclusive  ::)

CONCLUSION
Overall, according to our systematic review, both beneficial and adverse cardiovascular events can be discovered following the chronic use of various types of SSRIs

15
If a person is deficient in ANY other mineral, vitamin, chemical etc itnwould mean the lerson is not in normal health. Almoat any time anlerson is WAY outside what is normal and expected for health parameters, we do things to help get us back into that normal range. And when we do that, typically the person become MORE healthy and overall well.  As long as we medicate or supplement correctly and donít go extreme.

I believe testosterone replacement should not be expected to be any different.

If we are deficient in vitamin d we take the necessary amount to get back to normal. We woild woth Iron too, or thyroid. And when we do, the person feels better. Why would getting testosterone where it is supoosed to be somehow be a complication and make people sick? 

Exactly how does the body realy know if it is getting testosterone from your testicles or from an injection?  As long as the body is getting what it needs to function well, that is the bottom line.

I am not saying that getting optimized and balancing all the hormones with trt is easy. Not at all. Iím just believing that if a person is within limits I do not believe it will be long term negative heakth consequences. Maybe this is nust my naive wishful thinking. 

I choose to believe having all levels within working functional optimized limits will result in overall better health. When any thing or multiple things get gravely out of whack. You will be unhealthy. And will be more healthy of you get the necessary medication to bring you back into range.

It is a quality of life issue. Do you want to feel like crap for the rest of your life, or do you want to try to feel better for what maybe a decade or more minimum?

I can tell you this. There are no guarantees in life. You donít even know you will get one more day. You only live once and you can never get ďlost yearsĒ back!
because the body doesnít work like that. Trt is not as simple as supplementing with a vitamin. With a vitamin you are just adding extra in. With trt you are on full replacement. You body is no longer producing on its own and other biological processes are shit down sometimes causing you to be deficient in other hormones and then starting the vicious cycle of trying to balance it all. Dr john always tried to use that logic but it didnít work. For me replacing testosterone lowered my already low normal cortisol to below range and man I felt it.  I had labs to prove it numerous times and he refused to acknowledge that. 

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