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Messages - doin it

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16
Thanks. I'll read up on all that. I pre-paid 2g's for TRT for 1 year. I'm 3.5 months into it, so unless i demand a refund and go somewhere else, i'm stuck with them. I did see the nurse today and i'll be starting HCG along with the T cypionate.

I requested my labs. i'll add them incase someone else wanted to chime in.

results from 1/3
testosterone - 309
free testosterone - 7.2
estridiol - 13.3

results from 2/22
testosterone - 722
free testosterone - 14.3
estridiol - 61.2

results from 3/23
testosterone - 450
free testosterone - 11.8
estridiol - 35.5

Should i jump on Arimidex since i'm about to start HCG?

------

No, your Estradiol is down, give it time.  4 weeks is not enough time to make a decision.  Adding two new drugs at once complicates dosing and finding your "maintenance level".

17
They're gonna have to have a really really good marketing team to get many guys to take this crap.

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No, as usual, just a lot of "consultant fees", gifts in one form or another, bought and paid for studies, etc. , etc. To doctors who will selfishly , calously, greedily, (ignorantly in a few caaes), prescribe this crap !

Thalidomide, progestin (synthetic, money-making, disease-causing  but patentable), ethinyl estradiol (synthetic, money-making, disease-causing  but patentable), Diethylstilbestrol (synthetic, money-making, disease-causing but patentable), etc., etc. All over again !

Along with their bought and paid for FDA !

So, what else is new???

18
They're gonna have to have a really really good marketing team to get many guys to take this crap.

-------

No, as usual, just a lot of "consultant fees", gifts in one form or another, bought and paid for studies, etc. , etc. To doctors who will selfishly , calously, greedily, (ignorantly in a few caaes), prescribe this crap !

Thalidomide, progestin (synthetic, money-making, disease-causing  but patentable), ethinyl estradiol (synthetic, money-making, disease-causing  but patentable), Diethylstilbestrol (synthetic, money-making, disease-causing but patentable), etc., etc. All over again !

Along with their bought and paid for FDA !

So, what else is new???


19
Thanks guys. My hope is to do sub Q for both hcg and test cyp when I start therapy. I prefer to avoid turning my legs into pin cushons.

I've been doing subq for a couple years. I watched Dr Crisler's instructional video. I use a 30g and only go about 3/8" or less. If you have any worries, search youtube for "little girl injects insulin". I did IM injections since 2006, but I quit after hitting an artery, twice. Just my luck. To make subq sting less, wait for the alcohol to dry and insert slowly, not fast (just my experience). Also, eat a lot of ice cream so that you have enough stomach fat to inject into (just kidding, sort of).

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Test,
If you don't mind sharing, what were the symptoms of hitting an artery ?  And what did you do ?
Thanks

Blood gushed out with each heartbeat. Both times I aspirated and saw no blood. Great way to lower my blood count I guess. Also in 2006 a nurse injected me at my endocrinologist appointment and I got dizzy, had like an asthma attack, and my heart started racing. Not sure if she injected the wrong stuff or if she hit something.
[/quot

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"Blood gushed out with each heartbeat", what did you do (both times) ?

20
Thanks guys. My hope is to do sub Q for both hcg and test cyp when I start therapy. I prefer to avoid turning my legs into pin cushons.

I've been doing subq for a couple years. I watched Dr Crisler's instructional video. I use a 30g and only go about 3/8" or less. If you have any worries, search youtube for "little girl injects insulin". I did IM injections since 2006, but I quit after hitting an artery, twice. Just my luck. To make subq sting less, wait for the alcohol to dry and insert slowly, not fast (just my experience). Also, eat a lot of ice cream so that you have enough stomach fat to inject into (just kidding, sort of).

-------

Test,
If you don't mind sharing, what were the symptoms of hitting an artery ?  And what did you do ?
Thanks


21

A lot of guys do IM injects in the glutes and, I have read, SubQ in the fatty glute areas.  I thought the following may be of interest regarding the Sciatic Nerve and avoiding it during injects.

http://teachmeanatomy.info/lower-limb/nerves/the-sciatic-nerve/
What happens if you were to hit the sciatic nerve?  And how deep is that nerve?  I use 1/2" syringes and I'm not very careful about where in my glute I put it.  Am I in any danger w/ that shallow of a needle?

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Sounds like a question for Drs. Crisler and/or Saya.

22

A lot of guys do IM injects in the glutes and, I have read, SubQ in the fatty glute areas.  I thought the following may be of interest regarding the Sciatic Nerve and avoiding it during injects.

http://teachmeanatomy.info/lower-limb/nerves/the-sciatic-nerve/


23
anyone?
what are you questioning?

-------

Joe,
He is referring to Dr. John's post at the top of the thread.

Jay
Maybe look into reducing E2 metabolism.

 http://www.drdebe.com/articles/safe-alternatives-to-estrogen-replacemen

"A number of natural compounds can slow the breakdown, and thus increase retention, of estrogen in the body. These include grapefruit, the B vitamin PABA, and the plant compound quercetin. The mineral boron has been shown to raise estrogen levels in postmenopausal women."

I think there may be other foods/supps that also do this.

Something else to look into are foods/supps that affect the P450 liver enzymes.
e.g.
Cytochrome P450 1A2 (CYP1A2) is responsible for the metabolism of estrogens and many exogenous compounds, including caffeine.

24

A lot of guys do IM injects in the glutes and, I have read, SubQ in the fatty glute areas.  I thought the following may be of interest regarding the Sciatic Nerve and avoiding it during injects.

http://teachmeanatomy.info/lower-limb/nerves/the-sciatic-nerve/

25
Dr. Crisler, one of the two (great) Doctors that haunt this forum (Dr. Saya being the other one) did a fairly famous video on SubQ injections that helped me very early on.  Unlike his use of needle size, I use a 29 ga, 1/2 inch one piece 3/10 syringe.  I believe he also has gone to smaller needles as well.  Also, I do kind of pinch up the skin, maybe two inches between thumb and forefinger for the injection.  Click the following link for his video (a little down from the top of the page):

 http://www.allthingsmale.com/community/threads/announcing-release-of-the-subcutaneous-injection-instruction-video.21497/

My original T Doc had his nurse walk me through my first inject, but it was a LOT easier than I thought it would be.  maybe you could get a nurse at one of the walk-in clinics to walk you thru it ( if in the U.S.A.)  Like the other guys said "no big deal", really, nothing to it for SubQ, don't know about IM.


26

I have not seen this movie YET, it was recommended highly, but have ordered the DVD.  The following review further inspired me to buy it, along with 14,816 others (that rated it 88 % "1" and "2".  I am always looking for inspirational movies.

" This was my cure for cancer. No joke. After chemo, after radiation, there comes the anxiety of how to live "cancer free." When will it come back? Will my life every be the same? Will I ever be normal? If the Martian can live with all his uncertainty about survival, I sure can too! Didn't expect this movie to be life-changing or a cancer healing message, but maybe if you're struggling with any kind of anxiety, this movie and how its main character faces his problems head on, without worrying about when the next one will come, can be inspirational to you too"

The Martian

 https://www.amazon.com/Martian-Blu-ray-Matt-Damon/dp/B017S3OP34/ref=sr_1_3?s=movies-tv&ie=UTF8&qid=1521860436&sr=1-3&keywords=The+martian&dpID=51pSxH8tGRL&preST=_SY300_QL70_&dpSrc=srch


27
So why not just get something from a reputable source that you know follows some kind of good manufacturing practices and tests for impurities?

Would love to, but it seems that here we can get only Testim gel, Nebido (tesosterona undeconate) and maybe some Sustanon.
Testim seems week, but will see after labs tomorrow. Nebido - I don't like that huge half life and wide swings it causes. Didn't feel good on it. And of course, that NKNW stuff looks half the price of Nebido and Testim, don't know about quality though... thats way I was asking ...

But I'll see tomorrow's lab results, as I am using HCG + Testim gel, maybe it can provide some respectable level for me, let's see ;)

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It looks like this is your first post since October 2016 and you did not indicate how you are feeling on present dose (nor any recent labs).  From your last paragraph, it sounds lIke you are chasing numbers (should not be the driving force) rather than feeling like you need to increase or decrease your dose.

Yes, haven't posted for quite a while... well all this time since last post I was trying to stay natural (started HCG+Testim only 2 weeks ago) and actually for some while got some modest results in 400-500ng/dl range, but all the time crashing regularly after improvements back to 250-380 range. Then, in last autumn, my SHBG suddenly climbed up from 20-22 to 29 and stays there and so I started to feel even worse. Also my cortisol, which was more or less ok, dropped significantly. Waiting for "ADR formula" supplement from PureEncapsulations to try to address that.
Well, regarding chasing numbers - indeed now I have set myself a target to reach 700+ ng/dl with pharmacy and stay there for some time to see and let body "repair the damage", but before that I was not chasing it, but every time this problem comes back to me in very physical way.

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Nick,
Did not mean to imply numbers are not important (they are), just that some guys think they cannot feel good until they are at some number.
Speaking of numbers, if you have some from your last labs you would like to share, it would help a lot as a lot of the guys on this forum are VERY good at analyzing the meaning of lab results.  This would be especially helpful if you provide the newer results as well for a comparison.  Btw, 700 to 800 is a good target range as a lot oF guys say they feel good in this range.

I'm not sure the difference between SHBG 21 (avg) and 29 is enough to get sweaty about as I have noted that the Docs on this forum have said these results can vary a LOT hour-to-hour, day-to-day, week-to-week.  But I did notice that you said it "stays there" at 29 from 21, so I'm not sure if that difference is operative or not (although you said that you felt worse with that change), since mine is always high.  So, I'll leave that up to someone on the forum more knowledgable to comment on.

Good luck on the Pituitary issue, I would probably get a second opinion on that.


28
So why not just get something from a reputable source that you know follows some kind of good manufacturing practices and tests for impurities?

Would love to, but it seems that here we can get only Testim gel, Nebido (tesosterona undeconate) and maybe some Sustanon.
Testim seems week, but will see after labs tomorrow. Nebido - I don't like that huge half life and wide swings it causes. Didn't feel good on it. And of course, that NKNW stuff looks half the price of Nebido and Testim, don't know about quality though... thats way I was asking ...

But I'll see tomorrow's lab results, as I am using HCG + Testim gel, maybe it can provide some respectable level for me, let's see ;)

-------

It looks like this is your first post since October 2016 and you did not indicate how you are feeling on present dose (nor any recent labs).  From your last paragraph, it sounds lIke you are chasing numbers (should not be the driving force) rather than feeling like you need to increase or decrease your dose.

29

Don'T get Catitude about it now, just a friendly discussion...

30
So, the takeaway here is that if you want normal (whatever that is) Growth Hormone levels, stay away from MSG under all its names on food labels aka hydrolyzed vegetable protein, natural flavoring, vegetable protein, and spices, 12 to 60 % msg.
You would think that a food additive that was good for you would be proud of its name and not be disguised with so many names.

We've beaten this subject to death in other threads and the MSG hysteria is not grounded in reality. There are countless studies demonstrating the safety of this additive. BTW, are breast-feeding mothers poisoning their babies because their milk is high in glutamate?

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You say beaten to death in other threads, sounds like arm-waving to me.

This subject will never die as long as scientific papers such as Elecrisio posted keep coming up.

So I guess once again, we will have to agree to disagree and let everyone research and decide for themselves.


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