Quantcast

Author Topic: Testosterone Replacement, Libido and Aging Spouse, Menopause  (Read 19840 times)

Az4Stringer

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 33
    • View Profile
Re: Testosterone Replacement, Libido and Aging Spouse, Menopause
« Reply #15 on: October 25, 2016, 03:57:36 pm »
Golfboy307:

I agree we should be patient with our spouses to a reasonable degree, like I said I went through the same thing for a short time before realizing I needed  help with my hormones. Back 10-15 years ago there wasn't as much information on low T as there is today.  Low T was considered part of the aging process by most docs. If it wasn't for my dad, I would have suffered longer. 

Unlike your wife who is excited about TRT and making an effort to getting better, my wife does not seem to want to get better or make the effort to take care of herself. Not just for our marriage but for her well being as well. When I first started TRT, I did a lot of research, found my Urologist was too old school with large infrequent injections. I found a great, knowledgeable local TRT doc to do it right.  What do you do when the other person doesn't want to make the effort even after numerous discussions?

Cujet:

"I'm happy, but you can't have me, and you can't have anybody else!" Exactly! I feel like she likes the idea and security of being the wife and best friend, but not longer wants to be the lover.   99% of the time when I have tried to initiate intimacy over the past 5-6 years, I get rejected. After I get brushed away, I find her watching TV, on Facebook or doing work and church stuff.  I am at the point now where I am hesitant to initiate and feelings of resentment are there.  I am going to suggest we seek counseling.

I hope I did not hijack your thread. Sorry if I did. You can see, your thread  touched a major frustration in my life.


golfboy307

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1101
    • View Profile
Re: Testosterone Replacement, Libido and Aging Spouse, Menopause
« Reply #16 on: October 25, 2016, 04:54:18 pm »
I agree AZ4, it can be hard if the person doesn't want to change or improve themselves.  Aging hits all differently, and some people just resign themselves to it.  I wish I had better advice for you.  Note:  my wife actually hasn't gone to that doctor yet, but she seems intent on it.  Guess we will see...
Age 51, 5'10, 155 lbs
Cholesterol 162 (HDL 59, LDL 87, Trigs 88, LDL-P 850)
Fasting Glucose 65 (down from 97 pre TRT)
A1C:  5.0 (down from 5.7 per TRT)
Homocysteine:  12.4 > 11.0 > 10.2 > 8.9 using B vitamin therapy.  MTHFR positive 

BP  120/78 (using improved diet and 10 mg Lisinopril ACE Inhibitor)  145/90 prior to meds.

Current protocol:  60 mg Test Cyp IM every 5 days.  No AI.
2/15/17 labs:  Total T (peak day): 1169 (250 - 1100 ng/dl).  Free T 198 pg/ML (46-225).  Sensitive E2: 40 High.  Previously 32. PSA 0.2  Hemocrit 44.2. SHBG: 32
9/15/18 labs:  Total T (trough day):  598 (250 -1100 ng/dl)  Free T 73.9 (46-225) Sensitive E2: 21  Hemocrit 43.7  SHBG 34
2/20/19 labs:  Total T (mid point):  776 (250 -1100 ng/dl) Free T 115.6 (46 - 224 pg/ml) Sensitive E2 24 (<29), DHT 43 (16-79 ng), DHEA-s 244 (70-495 mcg/dl)


Supplements:  Multivitamin, plus additional B12, B6, C, D, K2, Red Yeast Rice, Magnesium, and Coq10  Evening:  Kyolic Garlic, 2mg Cialis, LEF Endothelial Protection

Peak Testosterone Forum

Re: Testosterone Replacement, Libido and Aging Spouse, Menopause
« Reply #16 on: October 25, 2016, 04:54:18 pm »


cujet

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1160
    • View Profile
Re: Testosterone Replacement, Libido and Aging Spouse, Menopause
« Reply #17 on: October 25, 2016, 05:16:55 pm »

Cujet:

"I'm happy, but you can't have me, and you can't have anybody else!" Exactly! I feel like she likes the idea and security of being the wife and best friend, but not longer wants to be the lover.   99% of the time when I have tried to initiate intimacy over the past 5-6 years, I get rejected. After I get brushed away, I find her watching TV, on Facebook or doing work and church stuff.  I am at the point now where I am hesitant to initiate and feelings of resentment are there.  I am going to suggest we seek counseling.

I hope I did not hijack your thread. Sorry if I did. You can see, your thread  touched a major frustration in my life.


It's not a hijack at all. In fact, your thoughts are exactly what I am preaching about. We as humans, have a limited time for "all of this". True, we can't predict the future, but some things are a near certainty. Menopause is one of them. Sadly, most men do not have the foresight to comprehend the likely future.

We can only get kicked in the nuts so many times before serious injury results.

Another excellent point above by Az4 was that "we should be patient with our spouses to a reasonable degree" . To that I would add, Absolutely and that degree varies by age! Barring abnormal health or extraordinary circumstances, in our 30's and 40's, bad behavior, because that's what it is, is truly inexcusable. Looking back, I'd say bad behavior duration of 3 weeks is time to call it, via civil discussion. In our 50's, many months of patience and understanding might be prudent.

I view it this way. Little girls like horses, not for the same reason boys like cars. It's a proven fact girls like to control a much larger, and much more powerful being. Boys like cars for freedom.

Some things never change

« Last Edit: October 28, 2016, 08:28:48 pm by cujet »
58 years old
Autoimmune Hashimoto's, near zero natural T production
Cause: severe mononucleosis in my early 30's
Weight 235 and climbing despite eating far less
Height 5' 10"
180mg NPthyroid (natural desiccated pigs thyroid)
Labs (Oct 2017) , my T=730, TSH 0.03, T3+T4 mid-range normal.
Prednisone 10mg/day (no ACTH, dangerously low cortisol)
 
10% compounded creme. T=725, which feels just right.

PeakT

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 38446
    • View Profile
    • Peak Testosterone
Re: Testosterone Replacement, Libido and Aging Spouse, Menopause
« Reply #18 on: October 25, 2016, 07:03:02 pm »
Just a quick dispatch from my end:  my wife (1 year older, 51) is just now starting to hit some of the unpleasant menopause symptoms:  weight gain (she has been skinny her whole life), fatigue and dwindling libido.  After four years of low T from my end of the bed, I have complete sympathy for what she is going through.  She put up with my lack of energy, bad mood, and intermittent sex for long time.  I tell her now, "I owe you some patience after what you went though with me".  Maybe we are lucky it hit me first in that regard.  But here is where I am hopeful:  she is so impressed with my turnaround on TRT, she wants to go see my doctor.  Like Dr. Saya, they treat over 60% women in their office.  She is ready to fire her OB who says, "It is normal, you are fine" without pulling any labs.  So, I am going to encourage her along that path. 

You all bring up very good points here.  She even warned me:  you are going to start feeling better right around the time it hits me.  Hate when she is right...  ;D >:(

Let us know how it goes for her and what happens.  A lot of guys on here would be int'd I think (if you feel comfortable).
THE MOST COMPREHENSIVE BOOK ON TRT/TESTOSTERONE:
https://www.amazon.com/Natural-Versus-Testosterone-Therapy-Myer/dp/1523210532/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1499116128&sr=8-1&keywords=natural+versus+testosterone+therapy
And check out my New Peak Testosterone Program: http://www.peaktestosterone.com/peak_testosterone_program
If you are on medications or have a medical condition, always check with your doctor first before making any lifestyle changes or taking new supplements.  And low testosterone is a medical condition.

Peak Testosterone Forum

Re: Testosterone Replacement, Libido and Aging Spouse, Menopause
« Reply #18 on: October 25, 2016, 07:03:02 pm »


golfboy307

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1101
    • View Profile
Re: Testosterone Replacement, Libido and Aging Spouse, Menopause
« Reply #19 on: October 25, 2016, 08:53:17 pm »
I will let you know, have to get her there first!  She is generally very concerned with her well being and appearance.  I think she is motivated.
Age 51, 5'10, 155 lbs
Cholesterol 162 (HDL 59, LDL 87, Trigs 88, LDL-P 850)
Fasting Glucose 65 (down from 97 pre TRT)
A1C:  5.0 (down from 5.7 per TRT)
Homocysteine:  12.4 > 11.0 > 10.2 > 8.9 using B vitamin therapy.  MTHFR positive 

BP  120/78 (using improved diet and 10 mg Lisinopril ACE Inhibitor)  145/90 prior to meds.

Current protocol:  60 mg Test Cyp IM every 5 days.  No AI.
2/15/17 labs:  Total T (peak day): 1169 (250 - 1100 ng/dl).  Free T 198 pg/ML (46-225).  Sensitive E2: 40 High.  Previously 32. PSA 0.2  Hemocrit 44.2. SHBG: 32
9/15/18 labs:  Total T (trough day):  598 (250 -1100 ng/dl)  Free T 73.9 (46-225) Sensitive E2: 21  Hemocrit 43.7  SHBG 34
2/20/19 labs:  Total T (mid point):  776 (250 -1100 ng/dl) Free T 115.6 (46 - 224 pg/ml) Sensitive E2 24 (<29), DHT 43 (16-79 ng), DHEA-s 244 (70-495 mcg/dl)


Supplements:  Multivitamin, plus additional B12, B6, C, D, K2, Red Yeast Rice, Magnesium, and Coq10  Evening:  Kyolic Garlic, 2mg Cialis, LEF Endothelial Protection

dfs

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 38
    • View Profile
Re: Testosterone Replacement, Libido and Aging Spouse, Menopause
« Reply #20 on: October 26, 2016, 02:08:34 pm »
Thank you for the comments on this subject. It is good to know I am not alone. The wife and I have been talking and fighting about this for ten years.
It is like living with an alcoholic that wonít admit there is a problem. In the beginning it was always my fault, not doing something right. Now I think she is starting to realize it could be a physical problem. I have purchased books, printed articles, ask her to try supplements, make a Doctor appointment, exercise but nothing happens ďthere is nothing wrong with me, this is just how it is going to beĒ. The only progress is that she sometimes takes fish oil, it helped a little. I donít want to threaten with divorce because that is not what I want. If I donít initiate, there is no sex. She would rather watch a movie she has seen six times. If we were in our seventies It would be less of an issue (we are 54). I do realize that teenagers, work and stress makes it worse.

cujet

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1160
    • View Profile
Re: Testosterone Replacement, Libido and Aging Spouse, Menopause
« Reply #21 on: October 26, 2016, 09:28:46 pm »
  If we were in our seventies It would be less of an issue (we are 54). I do realize that teenagers, work and stress makes it worse.


I can't imagine that I would have any possible performance at 70. As it is, I'm disintegrating at a fairly rapid rate. Hence my warning, make hay while the sun shines!

I'm 53 and I'm annoyed with myself for not filling my 40's with sex. If I were to guess, I'd say that in fewer years than I'd like, say by 60 or so, horny or not, I won't be able.

58 years old
Autoimmune Hashimoto's, near zero natural T production
Cause: severe mononucleosis in my early 30's
Weight 235 and climbing despite eating far less
Height 5' 10"
180mg NPthyroid (natural desiccated pigs thyroid)
Labs (Oct 2017) , my T=730, TSH 0.03, T3+T4 mid-range normal.
Prednisone 10mg/day (no ACTH, dangerously low cortisol)
 
10% compounded creme. T=725, which feels just right.

Joe Sixpack

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2314
    • View Profile
Re: Testosterone Replacement, Libido and Aging Spouse, Menopause
« Reply #22 on: October 27, 2016, 02:59:18 am »
I believe that wives will get away with whatever you let them get away with.  It is important to set boundaries and expectations.  I have made it crystal clear to my wife over the years of our 28 year marriage that I will tolerate a lot of crap, but I refuse to tolerate no sex.  If she's got some physical or hormonal issues going on, I understand.  But she's gonna have to get it fixed. 

We had slightly mismatched expectations about frequency and priority of sex early in the marriage.  But that problem went away over time as I continually trained her as to what my expectations are.    I used to get pushback periodically when I would try to line up "dates".  So I started telling her this all the time, "I am going to have sex with someone today.  I hope it is with you".   It didn't take long for her to realize that sex was a high priority with me.  Now after 28 years of me training her how to behave I rarely have to initiate.  She proactively makes dates with me for sex. 

I don't want to sound like a jerk about this or to sound like I am bragging or anything like that.  My point is that expectations have to be set.  And your wife has to believe that if she doesn't keep you happy and sexed up that you are not going to tolerate it.  In a perfect world it wouldn't be necessary to play hardball like that.  But it was in my case.  And my wife loves me like crazy.  So even in a loving marriage this kind of expectation setting is important. 

Just like everyone else, I first tried talking it out with my wife.  She would be more responsive for a bit, but then go back to giving me crap about wanting sex.  After failing at that method, I realized that I was going to have to be more blunt about it as described above.   
Age: 55, Ht: 5'08", Wt: 155 lbs
Protocol: 25 mg T Cyp + 25 IU HCG M,W,F + 2 clicks T Cream + 15mg DHEA + 15mg Pregnenalone daily.
12/2018 test results: TT: 1054 ng/dL (264-916), FT: 17.2 pg/mL (7.2-24), E2: 21.6 pg/mL sensitive (8.0-35.0)

Runnerman

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 150
    • View Profile
Re: Testosterone Replacement, Libido and Aging Spouse, Menopause
« Reply #23 on: October 27, 2016, 03:08:46 am »
Hence my warning, make hay while the sun shines!

I'm 53 and I'm annoyed with myself for not filling my 40's with sex.

I've been feeling the same way. Maybe it's a middle age thing where you see how much time you have left and want to make it as fulfilled as possible. That comment about regretting not filling your 40's with sex hit me kind of hard. I'd been hoping things would get better but maybe the realization that it won't is setting in.
Bio Age - 53, 5'9" 170lbs
2/2007 - Diagnosed with Hashimoto's
-----------------
6/2017 - 120mg cypionate IM every 7 days

TSH 2.05 on 88mcg synthroid

cujet

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1160
    • View Profile
Re: Testosterone Replacement, Libido and Aging Spouse, Menopause
« Reply #24 on: October 28, 2016, 11:39:17 am »
I believe that wives will get away with whatever you let them get away with.  "I am going to have sex with someone today.  I hope it is with you"....    I realized that I was going to have to be more blunt about it as described above.   

Some women will respond to such tactics, some will not. Every person is different. My closest friend tried that method too, and ended up divorced 3 times. His last wife became frigid beyond belief after 2 kids, and remains single after the divorce.

Some behaviors are difficult to forecast, menopause and the issues it carries are however, predictable.

 

Sounds like you have an awesome wife!
« Last Edit: October 28, 2016, 08:20:57 pm by cujet »
58 years old
Autoimmune Hashimoto's, near zero natural T production
Cause: severe mononucleosis in my early 30's
Weight 235 and climbing despite eating far less
Height 5' 10"
180mg NPthyroid (natural desiccated pigs thyroid)
Labs (Oct 2017) , my T=730, TSH 0.03, T3+T4 mid-range normal.
Prednisone 10mg/day (no ACTH, dangerously low cortisol)
 
10% compounded creme. T=725, which feels just right.

Joe Sixpack

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2314
    • View Profile
Re: Testosterone Replacement, Libido and Aging Spouse, Menopause
« Reply #25 on: October 29, 2016, 12:28:12 am »
I believe that wives will get away with whatever you let them get away with.  "I am going to have sex with someone today.  I hope it is with you"....    I realized that I was going to have to be more blunt about it as described above.   

Some women will respond to such tactics, some will not. Every person is different. My closest friend tried that method too, and ended up divorced 3 times. His last wife became frigid beyond belief after 2 kids, and remains single after the divorce.

Some behaviors are difficult to forecast, menopause and the issues it carries are however, predictable.
 
Sounds like you have an awesome wife!

My wife is pretty decent.  She just got back from the gym.  She weighs 129 these days.  I bit more than she or I want but still not bad for 53.  I have emphasized over time that I consider it important that she take care of herself.  So I set those expectations up pretty early on as well as the sex ones.     

And you are right, not all women are going to respond to my method.  If you don't set the expectations early on, it is tricky to try to do it after years of marriage. 

I truly believe that if my wife is not happily screwing me  on a routine basis, that she doesn't love me anymore.  I would consider that she is not holding up her end of the marital vows.  I would be happy to divorce her in this case.  Cuzz in my mind without sex the marriage is effectively over anyway.  It would suck to have to do that of course.  I am no looker by any means.  But there are single women out there who would be happy to have me and would enjoy sex with me.  I think my tactic worked on my wife partly because she really believes that I would leave her if she didn't do her wifely job. 
Age: 55, Ht: 5'08", Wt: 155 lbs
Protocol: 25 mg T Cyp + 25 IU HCG M,W,F + 2 clicks T Cream + 15mg DHEA + 15mg Pregnenalone daily.
12/2018 test results: TT: 1054 ng/dL (264-916), FT: 17.2 pg/mL (7.2-24), E2: 21.6 pg/mL sensitive (8.0-35.0)

Az4Stringer

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 33
    • View Profile
Re: Testosterone Replacement, Libido and Aging Spouse, Menopause
« Reply #26 on: October 29, 2016, 04:50:07 am »
Joe Sixpack:

I agree, without sex, the marriage is effectively over unless there is a serious illness preventing intimacy.  It is no longer a marriage, just roommates. For the last 5-6 years, I feel my wife likes being the wife and best friend but not the lover. The thing that sets a marriage relationship apart from any other relationships we have is the exclusive intimacy. 

I look back prior to the last 5-6 years, my wife was much more assertive sexually. Things like surprising me in the shower, leaving me notes. We skinny dipped in my parents pool, it was her idea. My parents were out of town on vacation at the time..lol If she was too tired because of the kids/work, she would always say let's make a "date" tomorrow.  Then the next day she would flirt about it, it made the "date" so much better. I do miss that a lot.

I also agree that spouses should do their best to take care of themselves, not just for themselves but for their marriage.  I have had many conversations with her over the last 5-6 years about all this. She does not take care of herself and says she does not have the time, but has time to spend hours on Facebook, doing work and church stuff. To me if it is important, you make it a priority and you find the time. 

dfs: You are so right, menopause has its issues but is predictable, and I would add treatable.  But if the other person will not admit there is a problem, does nothing about it and says that's how it is, where do you go from there other than divorce? My wife like yours would rather watch a movie, play Facebook games or do work stuff. Most of the time when I try to initiate any intimacy, she just brushes me off and will do the other things.  I have told my wife many times in the last 5-6 years that no part of our marriage vows was a vow of celibacy.


Joe Sixpack

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2314
    • View Profile
Re: Testosterone Replacement, Libido and Aging Spouse, Menopause
« Reply #27 on: October 29, 2016, 06:47:51 pm »
@Az4Stringer, I never had much success "talking it out" with my wife.  We would agree that sex is a priority and then after a while things would revert back.  Early on in my marriage I had to be the sexual leader, but after adjusting my approach, in the last 5 years, my wife has been the driver, like your wife used to be.

If you or anyone else is interested I can give you more details on what has actually worked for me.
Age: 55, Ht: 5'08", Wt: 155 lbs
Protocol: 25 mg T Cyp + 25 IU HCG M,W,F + 2 clicks T Cream + 15mg DHEA + 15mg Pregnenalone daily.
12/2018 test results: TT: 1054 ng/dL (264-916), FT: 17.2 pg/mL (7.2-24), E2: 21.6 pg/mL sensitive (8.0-35.0)

PeakT

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 38446
    • View Profile
    • Peak Testosterone
Re: Testosterone Replacement, Libido and Aging Spouse, Menopause
« Reply #28 on: October 30, 2016, 01:54:15 am »
@Az4Stringer, I never had much success "talking it out" with my wife.  We would agree that sex is a priority and then after a while things would revert back.  Early on in my marriage I had to be the sexual leader, but after adjusting my approach, in the last 5 years, my wife has been the driver, like your wife used to be.

If you or anyone else is interested I can give you more details on what has actually worked for me.

Lots of men will be interested - trust me.
THE MOST COMPREHENSIVE BOOK ON TRT/TESTOSTERONE:
https://www.amazon.com/Natural-Versus-Testosterone-Therapy-Myer/dp/1523210532/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1499116128&sr=8-1&keywords=natural+versus+testosterone+therapy
And check out my New Peak Testosterone Program: http://www.peaktestosterone.com/peak_testosterone_program
If you are on medications or have a medical condition, always check with your doctor first before making any lifestyle changes or taking new supplements.  And low testosterone is a medical condition.

Joe Sixpack

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2314
    • View Profile
Re: Testosterone Replacement, Libido and Aging Spouse, Menopause
« Reply #29 on: October 30, 2016, 03:49:21 am »
Alright.  I will put some thoughts together and post them. 
Age: 55, Ht: 5'08", Wt: 155 lbs
Protocol: 25 mg T Cyp + 25 IU HCG M,W,F + 2 clicks T Cream + 15mg DHEA + 15mg Pregnenalone daily.
12/2018 test results: TT: 1054 ng/dL (264-916), FT: 17.2 pg/mL (7.2-24), E2: 21.6 pg/mL sensitive (8.0-35.0)

Peak Testosterone Forum

Re: Testosterone Replacement, Libido and Aging Spouse, Menopause
« Reply #29 on: October 30, 2016, 03:49:21 am »