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After starting, did you find that your sleep...

Drastic improvement, fixed all my sleep problems
0 (0%)
Helped a lot, but not a total fix
2 (20%)
No significant change, more energy during the day though
1 (10%)
No significant change, still tired during the day
2 (20%)
Sleep got worse
4 (40%)
Not on TRT
1 (10%)

Total Members Voted: 10

Author Topic: Guys with sleep issues, how did TRT affect them?  (Read 334 times)

nissan1414

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Guys with sleep issues, how did TRT affect them?
« on: April 11, 2019, 12:46:45 pm »
Wondering how TRT has affected everyone's sleep. I struggle with insomnia and have for years, despite my best efforts. Used to sleep like a rock until about the same time the sexual issues started cropping up. How did it affect you?

StephCurryFtw

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Re: Guys with sleep issues, how did TRT affect them?
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2019, 11:34:03 pm »
TRT helped my sleep BUT only for a specific period of time before tolerance set it and then I was back in the same boat I started in. 

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Re: Guys with sleep issues, how did TRT affect them?
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2019, 11:34:03 pm »


Mr.L

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Re: Guys with sleep issues, how did TRT affect them?
« Reply #2 on: April 12, 2019, 09:44:25 am »
Wondering how TRT has affected everyone's sleep. I struggle with insomnia and have for years, despite my best efforts. Used to sleep like a rock until about the same time the sexual issues started cropping up. How did it affect you?

I sleep good now unless my E2 gets high.

StephCurryFtw

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Re: Guys with sleep issues, how did TRT affect them?
« Reply #3 on: April 12, 2019, 10:53:12 pm »
Wondering how TRT has affected everyone's sleep. I struggle with insomnia and have for years, despite my best efforts. Used to sleep like a rock until about the same time the sexual issues started cropping up. How did it affect you?

I sleep good now unless my E2 gets high.

How does one lower E2 without crashing it?  Do you know of any strategies e.g. diet, exercise, meds, supplements, combos of those things, etc that seem to have support; preferably with evidence, if at all possible? 

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Re: Guys with sleep issues, how did TRT affect them?
« Reply #3 on: April 12, 2019, 10:53:12 pm »


Cataceous

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Re: Guys with sleep issues, how did TRT affect them?
« Reply #4 on: April 13, 2019, 07:39:24 am »
...
How does one lower E2 without crashing it? ...

Micro-dose anastrozole with a lot of patience. You start with a very low dose and wait at least a couple weeks before testing estradiol, ideally with both immunoassay and mass spectrometry-based tests. Then titrate the dose in very small increments. Repeat the cycle as many times as needed.
I am not a medical doctor; any suggestions are meant to be discussed with your doctor.
Age: 57, Ht: 5'10", Wt: 158 lbs
Protocol: 18 mg T enanthate subQ qod, 250 IU hCG subQ qod, 70 mcg anastrozole qod, 6.25 mg DHEA orally bid
7-12/2018 test results: TT: 800 ng/dL, E2: 31 pg/mL LC/MS-MS, DHEA-S: 264 ug/dL (49-344)—SHBG ~30 nmol/L

Mr.L

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Re: Guys with sleep issues, how did TRT affect them?
« Reply #5 on: April 13, 2019, 08:28:20 am »
Wondering how TRT has affected everyone's sleep. I struggle with insomnia and have for years, despite my best efforts. Used to sleep like a rock until about the same time the sexual issues started cropping up. How did it affect you?

I sleep good now unless my E2 gets high.

How does one lower E2 without crashing it?  Do you know of any strategies e.g. diet, exercise, meds, supplements, combos of those things, etc that seem to have support; preferably with evidence, if at all possible?

Cataceous is exactly right. You have to be very patient and go slow and steady until you get it right. I think a daily dose of T helps as well.

StephCurryFtw

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Re: Guys with sleep issues, how did TRT affect them?
« Reply #6 on: April 14, 2019, 02:40:30 pm »
...
How does one lower E2 without crashing it? ...

Micro-dose anastrozole with a lot of patience. You start with a very low dose and wait at least a couple weeks before testing estradiol, ideally with both immunoassay and mass spectrometry-based tests. Then titrate the dose in very small increments. Repeat the cycle as many times as needed.

Interesting.  I've not heard of those techniques before.  Have much to learn myself. 

HRD LVN

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Re: Guys with sleep issues, how did TRT affect them?
« Reply #7 on: April 14, 2019, 10:12:37 pm »
Wondering how TRT has affected everyone's sleep. I struggle with insomnia and have for years, despite my best efforts. Used to sleep like a rock until about the same time the sexual issues started cropping up. How did it affect you?
TRT has not helped my sleep.
I had a mental breakdown back in 2015 with severe depression anxiety and panic attacks. TRT Got me thru everything but the ocassional panic attack which I have benzos for.
My sleep was a non issue until my my breakdown. Now the fear of an anxiety attack plagues me every night. Whiskey is my usual answer because I am so afraid of benzo addiction. Some if not many have issues with alcohol I don't. I can go for months without even a beer.

If you have issues with insomnia I would try to find a good therapist to get to the bottom of why you can't sleep. A good one can give you exersizes to help shutdown at night.
HTH
« Last Edit: April 14, 2019, 10:15:10 pm by HRD LVN »

StephCurryFtw

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Re: Guys with sleep issues, how did TRT affect them?
« Reply #8 on: April 15, 2019, 12:29:23 am »
Wondering how TRT has affected everyone's sleep. I struggle with insomnia and have for years, despite my best efforts. Used to sleep like a rock until about the same time the sexual issues started cropping up. How did it affect you?
TRT has not helped my sleep.
I had a mental breakdown back in 2015 with severe depression anxiety and panic attacks. TRT Got me thru everything but the ocassional panic attack which I have benzos for.
My sleep was a non issue until my my breakdown. Now the fear of an anxiety attack plagues me every night. Whiskey is my usual answer because I am so afraid of benzo addiction. Some if not many have issues with alcohol I don't. I can go for months without even a beer.

If you have issues with insomnia I would try to find a good therapist to get to the bottom of why you can't sleep. A good one can give you exersizes to help shutdown at night.
HTH

For me, benzo withdrawal was a cakewalk compared to SNRI withdrawal.  SNRI withdrawal was some of the most intense, brutal, prolonged, and agonizingly torturous withdrawal in medicines I've ever had to go through and I've went on and off them probably 6 times by this point in my life.  It is absolute hell for me getting off those. 

StephCurryFtw

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Re: Guys with sleep issues, how did TRT affect them?
« Reply #9 on: April 16, 2019, 04:40:13 pm »
Wondering how TRT has affected everyone's sleep. I struggle with insomnia and have for years, despite my best efforts. Used to sleep like a rock until about the same time the sexual issues started cropping up. How did it affect you?

I sleep good now unless my E2 gets high.

Can I ask what symptoms you get when you notice your E2 is high?  I'm wondering if they are similar to mine...

cujet

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Re: Guys with sleep issues, how did TRT affect them?
« Reply #10 on: April 17, 2019, 08:55:12 am »
I have no trouble sleeping, or sleeping through the night. However, when T levels exceed 1200 ng/dl, I wake up early AM and don't fall back asleep. It's my key indicator that levels are too high.
55 years old
Autoimmune Hashimoto's, near zero natural T production
Cause: severe mononucleosis in my early 30's
Weight 200
Height 5' 10"
190mg NPthyroid (natural dessicated pigs thyroid)
Labs (Oct 2017) , my T=730, TSH 0.03, T3+T4 mid-range normal.
 
Currently not using T of any sort due to low cortisol

Flyingfool

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Re: Guys with sleep issues, how did TRT affect them?
« Reply #11 on: April 17, 2019, 09:08:42 am »
I have no trouble sleeping, or sleeping through the night. However, when T levels exceed 1200 ng/dl, I wake up early AM and don't fall back asleep. It's my key indicator that levels are too high.

Do you mean your E2 levels or TT levels are too high, or both for the sleep problems?
52 year old, 5’-7” and 165 lbs.
exercise:swim 3x/wk & marrial arts 2x/wk

Blood tested 9/19/18

Total = 580 ng/dL (250-827) 59.9%
Free T= 6.87 (4.6- 22.4) 12.8% (10.8 calc)

SHBG= 39 10.0-50.0) 72.5%

Bio-avail= 14.2 (110-575) 8.0%

DHES =not tested %

Estradiol = 22 (<39)

DHES =231 (38-313) =45.5% tested 2/14/18

Currently on 50mcg Synthroid (T4)
TSH = 0.99
Free T4 = 1.30 (0.80 - 1.80)  =50.0% of range
Free T3 = 3.3 (2.3-4.2) = 52.6% of range
Current protocol: 100mg DIM once per day. Reduction back from 200 mg. For 12 weeks. raised total T, freeT remained basically unchanged due to increases SHBG. Estradiol decrease from 30 to 22. Felt no better and maybe worse than at 100mg DIM so going back starting 9/25/18

Mr.L

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Re: Guys with sleep issues, how did TRT affect them?
« Reply #12 on: April 17, 2019, 10:40:44 am »
Wondering how TRT has affected everyone's sleep. I struggle with insomnia and have for years, despite my best efforts. Used to sleep like a rock until about the same time the sexual issues started cropping up. How did it affect you?

I sleep good now unless my E2 gets high.

Can I ask what symptoms you get when you notice your E2 is high?  I'm wondering if they are similar to mine...

I get tired and lazy, cant sleep, have trouble thinking strait or overthinking things. a little emotional but that happens when it's low too, and I get a little bloated.

Rumtoto

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Re: Guys with sleep issues, how did TRT affect them?
« Reply #13 on: April 19, 2019, 02:12:09 am »
Looking at this from the other direction, sleep deprivation is known to affect T levels. But interestingly, this video with Dr Mohit Khera shows evidence that it is the second half, not the first half, of the night's sleep that is important for T levels: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CrHYaXHpgWE  from 56:10 onwards.

I've never been on TRT, my total T being over 1200 naturally, but I have chronically poor sleep after 3 or 4am. I'm wondering whether my brain senses that I have high T and is making sure my sleep is not good in the latter half of the night to prevent it going even higher?

Cataceous

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Re: Guys with sleep issues, how did TRT affect them?
« Reply #14 on: April 19, 2019, 02:41:53 am »
...
I've never been on TRT, my total T being over 1200 naturally, but I have chronically poor sleep after 3 or 4am. I'm wondering whether my brain senses that I have high T and is making sure my sleep is not good in the latter half of the night to prevent it going even higher?

It's an interesting idea. I can't inject testosterone before bed because it interferes with sleep. But there are other guys who are ok with late injections.
I am not a medical doctor; any suggestions are meant to be discussed with your doctor.
Age: 57, Ht: 5'10", Wt: 158 lbs
Protocol: 18 mg T enanthate subQ qod, 250 IU hCG subQ qod, 70 mcg anastrozole qod, 6.25 mg DHEA orally bid
7-12/2018 test results: TT: 800 ng/dL, E2: 31 pg/mL LC/MS-MS, DHEA-S: 264 ug/dL (49-344)—SHBG ~30 nmol/L

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Re: Guys with sleep issues, how did TRT affect them?
« Reply #14 on: April 19, 2019, 02:41:53 am »