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Author Topic: Clomid benefits tapering off  (Read 1779 times)

Mithion

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Clomid benefits tapering off
« on: July 22, 2019, 01:18:45 am »
So two years ago I was diagnosed with low T. Doctor started me on clomid since I was still young and wanted to have kids. After about a month on clomid therapy, my testosterone went from 150 to 580. At the time, I was feeling much better. But now at my first year appointment, my testosterone measured in the mid 300. Last week I got my results for my two year appointment and again my testosterone was in the mid 300s.

Why is it that I my testosterone dropped so much after that initial high? I donít feel significantly better now then before I got started on clomid. Has anybody else had this issue where clomid worked great at first but tapered off after a year? Seeing my urologist on Tuesday. What should I ask him?
Started TRT injections January 2020
Currently on 300mg test cyp every 2 weeks

Supplements: Vitamin C (1000mg morning and evening), Vitamin D (2000IU morning)

Other RX: Losartan 25mg

ghce

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Re: Clomid benefits tapering off
« Reply #1 on: July 22, 2019, 01:53:05 am »
I was recently on clomid for 12 months, initially like you with good T results and feeling pretty good. At about 10 months like you the T went down, the weight went on and the benefits evaporated
Age:60, Height 6' 3" weight 100KG
2014 Androderm Patches
2014-2016 Oral Andriol 160mg Daily
June 2016 Clomid/Serophene 12.5mg EOD
September 2016 no TRT all natural and supplements for the time being
February 2017 Testosterone cream 100mg daily

Sept 2016
Testosterone   8.2 nmol/l   9-38
Free Testosterone   239 pmol/l   L   250-800
SHBG:  14    nmol/L   9-60
Free Androgen index   586   >400
Oestradiol    112   pmol/L    <190
LH    2.6 IU/L Adult male   2 - 9 IU/L
FSH  1.4 IU/L Adult male L2 - 12 IU/L

22 November
T 6.8  nmol/L ( 9-38 ) L

March 2017
Testosterone:   45.0  nmol/L ( 9-38 ) H ( 1,323 ng/dl )
Free Testosterone:   1512  pmol/L ( 250-800 ) H
SHBG:   17  nmol/L ( 9-60 )
Plasma IGF-1:   227 ug/L ( 55-198 ) H
Plasma cortisol:   434 nmol/L ( 0600-1000 hrs 170-500 nmol/L )
HbA1c:   36 mmol/mol ( 20-40 )
LH:   <0.1 IU/L
FSH:   0.1 IU/L
DHT Plasma Dihydrotestosterone:   7455   pmol/L ( 223 ng/dl ) 
Reference Range Adult males  1000-6000 pmol/L

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Re: Clomid benefits tapering off
« Reply #1 on: July 22, 2019, 01:53:05 am »


Mithion

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Re: Clomid benefits tapering off
« Reply #2 on: July 22, 2019, 02:37:07 am »
I donít know what to do. Iím 35 and Iím concerned that shutting down my testosterone production so early with TRT will have long term health consequences. Not sure why clomid worked so well at the beginning and tapered off so quickly. Thinking about dumping it though.
Started TRT injections January 2020
Currently on 300mg test cyp every 2 weeks

Supplements: Vitamin C (1000mg morning and evening), Vitamin D (2000IU morning)

Other RX: Losartan 25mg

ghce

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Re: Clomid benefits tapering off
« Reply #3 on: July 22, 2019, 04:31:07 am »
TRT has no known long term health issues associated with it other than reduced or nil fertility, theoretically maintaining natural production via a serm such as Clomid is ideal however Clomid itself is not ideal and has side affects which are very common in men making it a not often used choice.

I wouldn't worry to much about TRT other than its pretty much a life long thing but if you want to opt out of it at any time you can and with the use of Clomid or similar can reduce the testosterone hole that will eventuate before getting back to your own natural albeit un-ideal T level that you started with.

For myself I have been on several different forms of TRT and dont really give it a 2nd thought when things go wrong, just change to a different protocol until that one crashes then cycle through the other potential protocols, rinse and repeat.

If fertility is an issue and you want kids later down the track you can go back to Clomid for 2 or 3 months until Spermatogenesis has completed or if your doc is willing try hcg.

Clomid with its bad sides may have worked for you in the short term but generally most men have a much better time of it on full TRT via injections or topical cremes (not androgel).
Age:60, Height 6' 3" weight 100KG
2014 Androderm Patches
2014-2016 Oral Andriol 160mg Daily
June 2016 Clomid/Serophene 12.5mg EOD
September 2016 no TRT all natural and supplements for the time being
February 2017 Testosterone cream 100mg daily

Sept 2016
Testosterone   8.2 nmol/l   9-38
Free Testosterone   239 pmol/l   L   250-800
SHBG:  14    nmol/L   9-60
Free Androgen index   586   >400
Oestradiol    112   pmol/L    <190
LH    2.6 IU/L Adult male   2 - 9 IU/L
FSH  1.4 IU/L Adult male L2 - 12 IU/L

22 November
T 6.8  nmol/L ( 9-38 ) L

March 2017
Testosterone:   45.0  nmol/L ( 9-38 ) H ( 1,323 ng/dl )
Free Testosterone:   1512  pmol/L ( 250-800 ) H
SHBG:   17  nmol/L ( 9-60 )
Plasma IGF-1:   227 ug/L ( 55-198 ) H
Plasma cortisol:   434 nmol/L ( 0600-1000 hrs 170-500 nmol/L )
HbA1c:   36 mmol/mol ( 20-40 )
LH:   <0.1 IU/L
FSH:   0.1 IU/L
DHT Plasma Dihydrotestosterone:   7455   pmol/L ( 223 ng/dl ) 
Reference Range Adult males  1000-6000 pmol/L

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Re: Clomid benefits tapering off
« Reply #3 on: July 22, 2019, 04:31:07 am »


seppuku

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Re: Clomid benefits tapering off
« Reply #4 on: July 22, 2019, 12:16:34 pm »
Similar patern here - clomid took me from low 300's up to 600+ after being on a few weeks. Mine was self treated, and i didn't test again for about five years, just assumed it would keep working. Various joint problems i was getting last year prompted me to want blood work, and after seeing an advert for Medichecks i got some done - i was lower than before i started, with LH near the top end of range.  I have a theory though, that  the stress on the gonads from high LH levels from the clomid causes a lot of free radicals inside the testes which reduces testosterone output, in fact i've read studies that say this can happen. I'm currently testing out using various antioxidant combo's while giving the clomid a break. So that might be something you'd to try before giving up on clomid, it probably works best when cycled either way, always using the lowest amount possible ie 12.5mg eod or even twice a week.

HRT Guru

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Re: Clomid benefits tapering off
« Reply #5 on: July 22, 2019, 01:47:22 pm »
If you're primary Hypogonadal, the problem is/was the testes, there's really no point in stimulating the testes that is going to result in much at least in the long term. If any one does well on Clomid in the long terms and I mean > 90 days they're usually referred to as being an Unicorn...it's that rare.

Mithion

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Re: Clomid benefits tapering off
« Reply #6 on: July 22, 2019, 03:19:51 pm »
Hey thanks for the replies! Perhaps the lack of long term positive results with clomid is an indication that I'm primary hypogonadal after all. My wife and I are currently trying for our second child. I'll talk to my doc tomorrow and see if he thinks I'm a candidate for TRT and if I can start after we conceive our second and hopefully last child.
Started TRT injections January 2020
Currently on 300mg test cyp every 2 weeks

Supplements: Vitamin C (1000mg morning and evening), Vitamin D (2000IU morning)

Other RX: Losartan 25mg

ghce

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Re: Clomid benefits tapering off
« Reply #7 on: July 22, 2019, 09:36:10 pm »
Those blood figures in your signature don't necessarily point to being Primary at all.

Men who are primary tend to have much more elevated LH and FSH levels to compensate for their lower T. Your LH and FSH look to be at "idle" and are figures a lot of Secondary guys seem to have pre treatment.
Age:60, Height 6' 3" weight 100KG
2014 Androderm Patches
2014-2016 Oral Andriol 160mg Daily
June 2016 Clomid/Serophene 12.5mg EOD
September 2016 no TRT all natural and supplements for the time being
February 2017 Testosterone cream 100mg daily

Sept 2016
Testosterone   8.2 nmol/l   9-38
Free Testosterone   239 pmol/l   L   250-800
SHBG:  14    nmol/L   9-60
Free Androgen index   586   >400
Oestradiol    112   pmol/L    <190
LH    2.6 IU/L Adult male   2 - 9 IU/L
FSH  1.4 IU/L Adult male L2 - 12 IU/L

22 November
T 6.8  nmol/L ( 9-38 ) L

March 2017
Testosterone:   45.0  nmol/L ( 9-38 ) H ( 1,323 ng/dl )
Free Testosterone:   1512  pmol/L ( 250-800 ) H
SHBG:   17  nmol/L ( 9-60 )
Plasma IGF-1:   227 ug/L ( 55-198 ) H
Plasma cortisol:   434 nmol/L ( 0600-1000 hrs 170-500 nmol/L )
HbA1c:   36 mmol/mol ( 20-40 )
LH:   <0.1 IU/L
FSH:   0.1 IU/L
DHT Plasma Dihydrotestosterone:   7455   pmol/L ( 223 ng/dl ) 
Reference Range Adult males  1000-6000 pmol/L

Mithion

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Re: Clomid benefits tapering off
« Reply #8 on: July 23, 2019, 04:15:34 am »
Yeah those results in my signature are what I started with. At my peak, about two months into my clomid therapy, my LH and FsH measured 9.1 and 6.7 respectively. But I havenít had those checked in nearly two years. Maybe Iíll ask him about it tomorrow see if he thinks they are worth checking.
Started TRT injections January 2020
Currently on 300mg test cyp every 2 weeks

Supplements: Vitamin C (1000mg morning and evening), Vitamin D (2000IU morning)

Other RX: Losartan 25mg

Peak Testosterone Forum

Re: Clomid benefits tapering off
« Reply #8 on: July 23, 2019, 04:15:34 am »