Opinions about my low T levels and Treatment

[PeakT]

Quincy:  Noone likes the 3 week cycle from what I've seen and everyone complains there are miserable that last week. 

Also, I cannot believe the comment about "getting you to feel good".  Man, that shows gross ignorance.  I would consider finding a more knowledgeable doc. 

[PeakT]

Quincy:  I split that last post out:

https://www.peaktestosterone.com/forum/index.php?topic=570.0

[Quincy]

Update: Oct 8, 2012

I've now had a 400mg TC shot the first 3 weeks and another 400mg the last 2 weeks. 800mg over the last 5 weeks. So I had my blood tested today, which is 13 days after my last injection. I have a doctors appt tomorrow morning and the plan is to review the blood test results and show me (my wife) how to self inject. He mentioned probably reducing the amount to 300mg every 2 weeks.. so I will see. I have no idea what my T level will be, but I will make a prediction. I noticed yesterday, the 12th day, I started feeling crappy. Today is the same (blood drawn today). Probably the best way to describe how I feel is it is similar to a very mild case of flu or something. Kind of achy and mentally more irritated. So my prediction is it will not be anything normal or above normal (550 or higher just to put a number on it).

I'll update my progress tomorrow after my appt. I'm starting to feel like a junky needing this stuff. I wonder how much of the downer feeling is withdrawal type symptoms or is this just the way I used to feel and got used to it. It is really hard for me to tell. I do know now the contrast is obvious and maybe that is because it happens over such a compressed time frame.

Just as an additional note, the 1st shot had basically the same affect. After about 12 days there was a noticeable downgrade in how I felt.

[PeakT]

I'm starting to feel like a junky needing this stuff. I wonder how much of the downer feeling is withdrawal type symptoms or is this just the way I used to feel and got used to it.

Imo there is no comparison between a guy restoring his hypogonadal testosterone levels from low to normal versus a junkie, who is shooting his neurotransmitters to supraphysiological levels.  That is what a steroid user does - pushing testosterone to unnatural levels.

[Quincy]

I think I’m still trying to get used to the idea of doing shots. Maybe in 3-4 months it won’t seem such a big thing.

Well I was right about my T level. It came in at 232… after 13 days. That’s just too long a time period and I could feel it. So my wife gave me a 300mg shot today, with the guidance of the nurse. I’ll have to stay on her good side on shot days particularly!

I asked the doctor for some latitude on the shots and he was good with that. Basically he prescribed 300mg of TC every 10 days… the shot I had today. I’ll see how that goes the next cycle and switch to 200mg a week if I don’t like it. I got a feeling I don’t like the big surge upfront and if I go weekly that will help. The other thing I’ll watch closely is the amount. 200mg a week seems like a lot. Without more info about E2, a beginning cycle T point and mid cycle T point, I don’t think there is enough info for dosing… based on a 13 day reading of 232. He basically left it where it is and said to come back in 6 months for another blood test.

I’ll have to ponder all this.

[PeakT]

I think I’m still trying to get used to the idea of doing shots. Maybe in 3-4 months it won’t seem such a big thing.

Well I was right about my T level. It came in at 232… after 13 days. That’s just too long a time period and I could feel it. So my wife gave me a 300mg shot today, with the guidance of the nurse. I’ll have to stay on her good side on shot days particularly!

I asked the doctor for some latitude on the shots and he was good with that. Basically he prescribed 300mg of TC every 10 days… the shot I had today. I’ll see how that goes the next cycle and switch to 200mg a week if I don’t like it. I got a feeling I don’t like the big surge upfront and if I go weekly that will help. The other thing I’ll watch closely is the amount. 200mg a week seems like a lot. Without more info about E2, a beginning cycle T point and mid cycle T point, I don’t think there is enough info for dosing… based on a 13 day reading of 232. He basically left it where it is and said to come back in 6 months for another blood test.

I’ll have to ponder all this.

Gotcha.  Well, everyone has to do what they feel comfortable with.  It your health after all....

But the every 10 days I think you are going to like much better no matter what the dosage.

[Quincy]

Well since starting injections on Sept 4th, things have progressed all for the better. At first the doctor was doing massive 400mg shots meant to last 3 weeks. Bad idea. Way too big of swings. I switched to weekly self injecting 200mg on Oct 18th. This is much better and I feel the best the first 5 days. Days 6 and 7 are good also, but I still look forward to getting the next shot each Thursday. I'm not scheduled to get a blood test until the end of March so I really don't know what my T levels are. The one blood test I had was on the 14th day back when I was taking the 400mg shots. My level was 232. I extrapolated based upon 1 data point  and figure my levels now fluctuate between 500 and 1000 during my weekly schedule of 200mg. It will be interesting to see what my actually T levels are in another 3 months.

I think every week continues to see subtle improvements in different areas. I have a lot more energy than I use to have. Jog 2 miles every morning, weight train 4 days a week and eat like a horse.

Libido has improved along with nightly erections and morning wood. Still rely on Cialis but things have improved. I hope to see slow but steady improvement to continue in this area as time marches on.

It is a continuous learning process and I look forward to more improvements in the future. My only regret is I didn't address my low T much sooner as I have been quite low for several years and felt like crap. Now that I know what it feels like not to feel like crap. I suspect there are a lot of older guys, like myself, that didn't realize just how sub par they felt, both physically and mentally.

I want to thank PeakT again for this valuable site as it has helped me immensely to understand the many unanswered questions of low T and the health risks. I doubt I would have been exposed to it for many years if ever and may have wasted a lot more future years.

[Simeoni]

Its always nice to see people recovering from the symptoms brought by low t.

One thing im wondering is the dosage. 200mg seems quite much per week. Have you had the chance to test E2 with that? That said, were all unique and I do know some quys who also take 200mg per week and seem to be doing just fine.

I Guess if your feeling good then theres nothing alarming going on. I would still test the E2 if possible.

Well since starting injections on Sept 4th, things have progressed all for the better. At first the doctor was doing massive 400mg shots meant to last 3 weeks. Bad idea. Way too big of swings. I switched to weekly self injecting 200mg on Oct 18th. This is much better and I feel the best the first 5 days. Days 6 and 7 are good also, but I still look forward to getting the next shot each Thursday. I'm not scheduled to get a blood test until the end of March so I really don't know what my T levels are. The one blood test I had was on the 14th day back when I was taking the 400mg shots. My level was 232. I extrapolated based upon 1 data point  and figure my levels now fluctuate between 500 and 1000 during my weekly schedule of 200mg. It will be interesting to see what my actually T levels are in another 3 months.

I think every week continues to see subtle improvements in different areas. I have a lot more energy than I use to have. Jog 2 miles every morning, weight train 4 days a week and eat like a horse.

Libido has improved along with nightly erections and morning wood. Still rely on Cialis but things have improved. I hope to see slow but steady improvement to continue in this area as time marches on.

It is a continuous learning process and I look forward to more improvements in the future. My only regret is I didn't address my low T much sooner as I have been quite low for several years and felt like crap. Now that I know what it feels like not to feel like crap. I suspect there are a lot of older guys, like myself, that didn't realize just how sub par they felt, both physically and mentally.

I want to thank PeakT again for this valuable site as it has helped me immensely to understand the many unanswered questions of low T and the health risks. I doubt I would have been exposed to it for many years if ever and may have wasted a lot more future years.

[PeakT]

and figure my levels now fluctuate between 500 and 1000 during my weekly schedule of 200mg. It will be interesting to see what my actually T levels are in another 3 months.

I bet it's higher than that at 200 mg.  But I think you'll get tested again soon and you can check it out then.

I want to thank PeakT again for this valuable site as it has helped me immensely to understand the many unanswered questions of low T and the health risks. I doubt I would have been exposed to it for many years if ever and may have wasted a lot more future years.

Glad something helped...

[Quincy]

Simeoni, I'll ask if he can add E2 to the blood work and hopefully he'll consent. The dosage is at the top end of the recommended range but I don't think I am going super high T serum levels, if I was to guess at this point. I'm basing that on how I feel on the 6th and 7th day each week. I think I could feel better with a little more on those days but it is not enough to motivate me to split the dosage and take injections twice a week. I'm sure that would make things even more level but weekly is good enough at least for now. My suspicions are I am a fast metabolizer and the cypionate gets absorbed  faster than average.


You could be right Peak. I am guessing my T level is a little low the last 2 days, the peak level couldn't be much more than double that numeric level. That's also part of how I estimated the 500 to 1000 guess. I wonder if I should have my blood test 48 - 72 hours after the last injection or find my lowest point on the 7th day? It would be nice to know both.

[PeakT]

You could be right Peak. I am guessing my T level is a little low the last 2 days, the peak level couldn't be much more than double that numeric level. That's also part of how I estimated the 500 to 1000 guess. I wonder if I should have my blood test 48 - 72 hours after the last injection or find my lowest point on the 7th day? It would be nice to know both.

I believe 100-150 is more the typical weekly dosage and that will get a guy usually roughly about 1200 peak, 800 trough.   But that's very rough and very individual of course.

Different docs test different ways.  Once a doc knows his typical curve, he can just measure your low point when you come in for your next shot and have a good idea just from that.  About two days after is peak and normally I don't think they want to test you then.

[Quincy]

My 6 month followup since beginning T shots. Doc prescribed me 200mg/wk back in Oct. After 3 months at that dosage I took it upon myself to reduce the amount to 180mg/wk. After 3 more months at that dosage I had my BW done. I wanted to know the absolute low serum T level so I had labs drawn at 8am an hour before my weekly injection (7 days). Went to the doc this morning and he asked how I was feeling. I said I feel good and didn't have any side effects. I mentioned I would like to have had a CBC test and told him I had my annual checkup with my Primary next week and would ask him to run that test.

He told me my T level was 1056 (CPL lab range 292-867). He was surprised that the blood was drawn on the 7th day. I was surprised at the high reading and was hoping it would be around 600. In any event he wants me to cut back to 100mg/wk and test again in 4-5 weeks. If I'm not feeling good that he would raise the dosage some and check my levels again. He also said if my primary doesn't do the hematocrit test to call him and he would order that one also. He actually didn't sound too concerned about that test but was willing to do it.

I wonder what my peak high level was? 2000 maybe? In any event it needs to be cut back. it's funny that I don't notice any negative side effects and hope the lower dosage comes back at 600 for the low point of the cycle. Another good sign is the doc seems more interested and testing more often than every 6 months. Maybe I can get him to do an E2 test at some point.

[PeakT]

I'd guess you were around 1300.

[Quincy]

All I know is I feel pretty good at this level and I hope there isn't much change if my levels drop from say 1300-1056 to 1056-600. I guess I will find out. I'm glad I am getting a RBC and hematocrit reading in the near future because that is one thing you don't mess around with running at too high of levels.

I still don't understand the half life stuff on cypionate. if it is 8 days on average (+/- 1 or 2 days) it seems like a reading of 1056 after 7 days would mean the high peak would be more than 1300. How are you estimating that? Or is it just from practical experience observing how others react?

[PeakT]

I still don't understand the half life stuff on cypionate. if it is 8 days on average (+/- 1 or 2 days) it seems like a reading of 1056 after 7 days would mean the high peak would be more than 1300. How are you estimating that? Or is it just from practical experience observing how others react?

I'm basing that on the fact that guys who get about 150 mg will usually peak around 950-1050 and valley around 750-850.  These are rought numbers, but there's usually a differential of about 250 from what I have heard.  Your differential should not be that much more proportionately...