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Author Topic: Physician HORROR STORY: Doc Says Low Estradiol Doesn't Matter  (Read 5911 times)

reddevil

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Hi All - went to a famous endo today and the visit was very disappointing. He felt my T was low but normal and it should not be the cause of my symptoms. He said extradiol is a female hormone and its good that its low. I tried to argue with him  with all the logic and details I have learnt here and elsewhere but he was adamant. He said I cannot be diagnosed as suffering from Hypogonadism because the LH and FSH are not high which they should have been if I had low T. And LH and FSH are not extremely low, so he ruled out the possibility of a benign pituitary tumor. He basically prescribed me some vitamins and relaxants [Vitamins Capsules A TO Z, Prothiadew (Dosulepin ), Nutrix (whey protein), Arcalion(Sulbutiamine)] and said I should feel much better after a month.

Guys - please help me out on my next steps. Do I visit another endo? My problem is all of them would have the same opinion (I have visited couple of urologists earlier) and in all probability they wouldn't treat me for low testosterone. Testosterone otherwise is available OTC very cheaply here in India but I don't want to self meditate.
Age: 33

My blood work prior to starting clomid:

TOTAL T: 270.09 ng/dl
FREE T:   5.84 pg/ml
FSH:    5.75 mIu/ml
LH:    4.16 miu/ml
SERUM PROLACTIN LEVEL:    11.39 ng/ml
SERUM ESTRADIOL E2:    <10 pg/ml
SHBG:  12.8 nmol/L
 
After about 4 weeks on clomid (25mg daily):

TESTOSTERONE, TOTAL 424.20 (241.00 - 827.00 ng/dl)
TESTOSTERONE,FREE 11.30 (8.9 - 42.5 pg/mL)
LUTEINIZING HORMONE 8.29 (1.50 - 9.30 mIU/mL)
FOLLICLE STIMULATING HORMONE 15.34 (1.40 - 18.10 mIU/mL)
PROLACTIN 7.37 (2.10 - 17.70 ng/mL)

Endo asked me to stop clomid and get retested after 4 weeks. Results after 4 weeks of stopping clomid:

Total T: 236 (240-827)
LH: 2.8 (range 1.5-9.3)
FSH: 6.1 (range 1.6-8)
E2: 13 (range <29)
PSA: 0.7 (range <4)

Kierkegaard

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Re: Physician HORROR STORY: Doc Says Low Estradiol Doesn't Matter
« Reply #1 on: June 04, 2014, 01:17:41 pm »
Hi All - went to a famous endo today and the visit was very disappointing. He felt my T was low but normal and it should not be the cause of my symptoms. He said extradiol is a female hormone and its good that its low. I tried to argue with him  with all the logic and details I have learnt here and elsewhere but he was adamant. He said I cannot be diagnosed as suffering from Hypogonadism because the LH and FSH are not high which they should have been if I had low T. And LH and FSH are not extremely low, so he ruled out the possibility of a benign pituitary tumor. He basically prescribed me some vitamins and relaxants [Vitamins Capsules A TO Z, Prothiadew (Dosulepin ), Nutrix (whey protein), Arcalion(Sulbutiamine)] and said I should feel much better after a month.

Guys - please help me out on my next steps. Do I visit another endo? My problem is all of them would have the same opinion (I have visited couple of urologists earlier) and in all probability they wouldn't treat me for low testosterone. Testosterone otherwise is available OTC very cheaply here in India but I don't want to self meditate.

No, it sounds like you had the expected experience with an endo.  I swear, these assholes...

Go to a general practitioner; from what I've read (and Peak can jump in on this), GPs are the most likely to prescribe TRT.  You can try looking up docs on the Life Extension Site to see if you can find one that's much more likely to be a good one: http://www.lef.org/Health-Wellness/InnovativeDoctors/
"The same thing that makes you live can kill you in the end." -- Neil Young

March 2014: Dx low T (158ng/dl)
September 2015: Dx hypothyroidism, other adrenal hypofunction
2016: chronic fatigue, unspecified

Depression and anxiety guide: http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Help_Anxiety_Depression

Peak Testosterone Forum

Re: Physician HORROR STORY: Doc Says Low Estradiol Doesn't Matter
« Reply #1 on: June 04, 2014, 01:17:41 pm »


PeakT

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Re: Physician HORROR STORY: Doc Says Low Estradiol Doesn't Matter
« Reply #2 on: June 04, 2014, 01:56:48 pm »
Hi All - went to a famous endo today and the visit was very disappointing. He felt my T was low but normal and it should not be the cause of my symptoms. He said extradiol is a female hormone and its good that its low. I tried to argue with him  with all the logic and details I have learnt here and elsewhere but he was adamant. He said I cannot be diagnosed as suffering from Hypogonadism because the LH and FSH are not high which they should have been if I had low T. And LH and FSH are not extremely low, so he ruled out the possibility of a benign pituitary tumor. He basically prescribed me some vitamins and relaxants [Vitamins Capsules A TO Z, Prothiadew (Dosulepin ), Nutrix (whey protein), Arcalion(Sulbutiamine)] and said I should feel much better after a month.

Guys - please help me out on my next steps. Do I visit another endo? My problem is all of them would have the same opinion (I have visited couple of urologists earlier) and in all probability they wouldn't treat me for low testosterone. Testosterone otherwise is available OTC very cheaply here in India but I don't want to self meditate.

Guys:  You can read his story here: https://www.peaktestosterone.com/forum/index.php?topic=4259.0

If your estradiol is really below 10 pg/ml, then you are asking for trouble allowing it to be that low for many reasons.  But one of the most important is that you can experience bone loss.  We've had guys on this forum who have had osteopenia and osteoporosis.

Can you verify that your labs said you were less than 10 pg/ml?

Read these articles and you will see additional reasons:

http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2010/may2010_Why-Estrogen-Balance-is-Critical-to-Aging-Men_01.htm

http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2008/nov2008_Dangers-of-Excess-Estrogen-in-the-Aging-Male_01.htm

Remember:  you don't want your estradiol too high or too low.

« Last Edit: June 04, 2014, 01:58:50 pm by PeakT »
THE MOST COMPREHENSIVE BOOK ON TRT/TESTOSTERONE:
https://www.amazon.com/Natural-Versus-Testosterone-Therapy-Myer/dp/1523210532/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1499116128&sr=8-1&keywords=natural+versus+testosterone+therapy
And check out my New Peak Testosterone Program: http://www.peaktestosterone.com/peak_testosterone_program
If you are on medications or have a medical condition, always check with your doctor first before making any lifestyle changes or taking new supplements.  And low testosterone is a medical condition.

reddevil

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Re: Physician HORROR STORY: Doc Says Low Estradiol Doesn't Matter
« Reply #3 on: June 04, 2014, 02:59:12 pm »
Hi All - went to a famous endo today and the visit was very disappointing. He felt my T was low but normal and it should not be the cause of my symptoms. He said extradiol is a female hormone and its good that its low. I tried to argue with him  with all the logic and details I have learnt here and elsewhere but he was adamant. He said I cannot be diagnosed as suffering from Hypogonadism because the LH and FSH are not high which they should have been if I had low T. And LH and FSH are not extremely low, so he ruled out the possibility of a benign pituitary tumor. He basically prescribed me some vitamins and relaxants [Vitamins Capsules A TO Z, Prothiadew (Dosulepin ), Nutrix (whey protein), Arcalion(Sulbutiamine)] and said I should feel much better after a month.

Guys - please help me out on my next steps. Do I visit another endo? My problem is all of them would have the same opinion (I have visited couple of urologists earlier) and in all probability they wouldn't treat me for low testosterone. Testosterone otherwise is available OTC very cheaply here in India but I don't want to self meditate.

Guys:  You can read his story here: https://www.peaktestosterone.com/forum/index.php?topic=4259.0

If your estradiol is really below 10 pg/ml, then you are asking for trouble allowing it to be that low for many reasons.  But one of the most important is that you can experience bone loss.  We've had guys on this forum who have had osteopenia and osteoporosis.

Can you verify that your labs said you were less than 10 pg/ml?

Read these articles and you will see additional reasons:

http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2010/may2010_Why-Estrogen-Balance-is-Critical-to-Aging-Men_01.htm

http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2008/nov2008_Dangers-of-Excess-Estrogen-in-the-Aging-Male_01.htm

Remember:  you don't want your estradiol too high or too low.

Hi PeakT, yes my SERUM ESTRADIOL E2 was <10 pg / ml (range: 11.6 - 41.2). I understand that low estradiol (like low testosterone) is dangerous esp for bone loss.   

What should be my next steps? I doubt a GP (as Kierkegaard suggested) would prescribe TRT for me in this part of the world. Docs generally here are so apprehensive and skeptical about TRT here for some reason. 

Also, in your opinion, do you think I am suffering from primary or secondary hypogonadism? My urologist said I have small testicles, but then my LH and FSH should have been high which they are not (FSH: 5.75 mIu/ml and LH: 4.16 miu/ml).

« Last Edit: June 04, 2014, 03:08:09 pm by reddevil »
Age: 33

My blood work prior to starting clomid:

TOTAL T: 270.09 ng/dl
FREE T:   5.84 pg/ml
FSH:    5.75 mIu/ml
LH:    4.16 miu/ml
SERUM PROLACTIN LEVEL:    11.39 ng/ml
SERUM ESTRADIOL E2:    <10 pg/ml
SHBG:  12.8 nmol/L
 
After about 4 weeks on clomid (25mg daily):

TESTOSTERONE, TOTAL 424.20 (241.00 - 827.00 ng/dl)
TESTOSTERONE,FREE 11.30 (8.9 - 42.5 pg/mL)
LUTEINIZING HORMONE 8.29 (1.50 - 9.30 mIU/mL)
FOLLICLE STIMULATING HORMONE 15.34 (1.40 - 18.10 mIU/mL)
PROLACTIN 7.37 (2.10 - 17.70 ng/mL)

Endo asked me to stop clomid and get retested after 4 weeks. Results after 4 weeks of stopping clomid:

Total T: 236 (240-827)
LH: 2.8 (range 1.5-9.3)
FSH: 6.1 (range 1.6-8)
E2: 13 (range <29)
PSA: 0.7 (range <4)

Peak Testosterone Forum

Re: Physician HORROR STORY: Doc Says Low Estradiol Doesn't Matter
« Reply #3 on: June 04, 2014, 02:59:12 pm »


PeakT

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Re: Physician HORROR STORY: Doc Says Low Estradiol Doesn't Matter
« Reply #4 on: June 05, 2014, 04:01:21 pm »
I split out some discussion on primary versus secondary hypogonadism:

https://www.peaktestosterone.com/forum/index.php?topic=4300.0

THE MOST COMPREHENSIVE BOOK ON TRT/TESTOSTERONE:
https://www.amazon.com/Natural-Versus-Testosterone-Therapy-Myer/dp/1523210532/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1499116128&sr=8-1&keywords=natural+versus+testosterone+therapy
And check out my New Peak Testosterone Program: http://www.peaktestosterone.com/peak_testosterone_program
If you are on medications or have a medical condition, always check with your doctor first before making any lifestyle changes or taking new supplements.  And low testosterone is a medical condition.

Peak Testosterone Forum

Re: Physician HORROR STORY: Doc Says Low Estradiol Doesn't Matter
« Reply #4 on: June 05, 2014, 04:01:21 pm »